eBay

stardust_tcg · ‎09-08-2020

Update to my previous post but for a quick recap:

I sold and shipped a phone on Aug 6, the package arrived at the post office on Aug 12. Aug 15 is the last shipping update saying delivery was attempted and to reschedule delivery. After back and forth between buyer for around 3 weeks (as of writing, Sep 9) and several calls to USPS, buyer has opened a case on PayPal despite telling them to contact post office about pick up. Last USPS call ended with a redelivery request in my name rather than the buyer.

This morning I called to cancel that redelivery and try to have USPS send a notice to the buyer's address but I was told the address I sent to is a business, not a home. Not only that but this address apparently comes up quite often with other sellers asking about delivery issues and that I could be getting scammed.

Simply put, what do I do? So far I've been gathering screenshots of my messages with the buyer, and my proof that I sent the item. The USPS representative also told me they would try to have some sort of email sent to me with proof that the package was delivered but not scanned, in order to send to PayPal should the situation escalate. I bought insurance on the package so I'm covered for that too. Is there anything else I should have? Should I escalate to PayPal first since I might be getting scammed? And lastly, if I need to share this address how do I do so without breaking the rules? Any and all help is appreciated, this whole situation has been stressful for me.

reallynicestamps · ‎09-09-2020

What is the address? More to the point if you enter the address on Google Maps, what do you see?

If it appears to be a business, and you can spot a name, google again to see what it is.

I'm thinking it may be a Freight Forwarder.

Now, usually that's not a problem. EBay has its own freight forwarder (the Global Shipping Program), and the reason they are a Good Thing is that when the forwarder accepts the shipment, your responsibility for delivery ends.

As does much of the Money Back Guarantee.

So check that out.

A forwarder wouldn't be bothered to pick up a parcel from the PO, they are too busy and it costs too much in labour.

Now about the Paypal Dispute -- which may actually be a credit card chargeback, but let's keep it simple.

You can provide a tracking number obviously, so put that into the PP Dispute.

The PP bot will be able to see that the shipment is waiting for pickup, and that is from the bot's point of view, the same as delivered.

The buyer should therefore lose the Dispute.

BTW, that also means you can keep the money.

But USPS has only so much room in the back of the PO so undeliverable mail is eventually marked Return to Sender. And slowly comes back to you.

Even more slowly with the political interference with the USPS and the already slow pandemic mailstream.

Do not think of refunding until you have your product back in your hands.

It might be an unexpected Christmas present.

Now you have it back, and neither eBay nor PP will make you refund the buyer.

Ethically, you probably should, minus the shipping costs, the eBay and Paypal fees, and perhaps even your packaging costs. Up to you.

stardust_tcg · ‎09-09-2020

@reallynicestamps wrote:
What is the address? More to the point if you enter the address on Google Maps, what do you see?
If it appears to be a business, and you can spot a name, google again to see what it is.
I'm thinking it may be a Freight Forwarder.
Now, usually that's not a problem. EBay has its own freight forwarder (the Global Shipping Program), and the reason they are a Good Thing is that when the forwarder accepts the shipment, your responsibility for delivery ends.
As does much of the Money Back Guarantee.
So check that out.

A forwarder wouldn't be bothered to pick up a parcel from the PO, they are too busy and it costs too much in labour.

Now about the Paypal Dispute -- which may actually be a credit card chargeback, but let's keep it simple.

You can provide a tracking number obviously, so put that into the PP Dispute.
The PP bot will be able to see that the shipment is waiting for pickup, and that is from the bot's point of view, the same as delivered.
The buyer should therefore lose the Dispute.
BTW, that also means you can keep the money.

But USPS has only so much room in the back of the PO so undeliverable mail is eventually marked Return to Sender. And slowly comes back to you.
Even more slowly with the political interference with the USPS and the already slow pandemic mailstream.
Do not think of refunding until you have your product back in your hands.
It might be an unexpected Christmas present.

Now you have it back, and neither eBay nor PP will make you refund the buyer.
Ethically, you probably should, minus the shipping costs, the eBay and Paypal fees, and perhaps even your packaging costs. Up to you.

Street view on Google Maps gives me nothing, but according to the Yellow Pages it is a Freight Forwarder. With terrible reviews. So I suppose it's the customer's fault for using such a **bleep**py service, but I doubt they'll care for what I have to say considering how all my other messages were received.

I know you said delivery isn't my responsibility anymore but is there anyway at this point for the buyer to actually get the package? That sounds easier than waiting to get it back and having to decide whether to refund them.

pjcdn2005 · ‎09-09-2020

Street view on Google Maps gives me nothing, but according to the Yellow Pages it is a Freight Forwarder. With terrible reviews. So I suppose it's the customer's fault for using such a **bleep**py service, but I doubt they'll care for what I have to say considering how all my other messages were received.

When I see negative comments when a freight forwarder was involved, they are usually from sellers who has problems with the buyers who used the forwarders. That doesn’t mean that the freight forwarder was bad, just that some of the people who used it were not always honest.

As far as the delivery not being your responsibility now...that may not be true. When an eBay claim is opened and there has been an attempted delivery, eBay does rule in favor of the seller. But PayPal require delivery...not attempted delivery. If I were you I would try to contact PP and explain the situation as there is always the chance that they will take the attempted delivery into account. If they don’t rule in your favor, I hope that the phone makes its way back to you.

reallynicestamps · ‎09-09-2020

Yes, PP and eBay do differ on details.

If the phone is not delivered, the postal system does normally return it to the sender, but this is at the best of times, very slow and at these are not the best of times.

That the buyer is Disputing is a signal to me that he did plan a scam, which may even have been stopped when the forwarder realized what seemed to be happening. I am feeling optimistic today.

stardust_tcg · ‎09-09-2020

If I were you I would try to contact PP and explain the situation as there is always the chance that they will take the attempted delivery into account.

Should this be done by escalating the case to PP or separately through customer service?

zee-chan-jpn-books · ‎09-10-2020

Completely off topic, but I looked at your listing and some of your shipping is too expensive. With most of your games, they are thinner than 2cm even if you wrap them with bubble wrap into an envelope. You can mail them using domestic lettermail instead, either under 100g or 200g, and that would cut your shipping down by at least $10. No one is gonna pay $14.47 shipping for that $1 Sengoku Basara game case lol.

I made this table with Canada Post shipping rates.

https://community.ebay.ca/t5/Seller-Central/2020-Canada-Post-unofficial-rates-chart-under-2kg/td-p/4...

pjcdn2005 · ‎09-10-2020

I would probably try to contact PP first If possible...rather than escalating. But I’ve heard that right now it isn’t as easy to contact them as it used to be so escalating might be the only option.

Did you ever get an explanation from the post office why they couldn’t deliver it to to that address the first time? Also,,,you said you cancelled the redelivery? Why? If it was delivered then the claim would be closed.

stardust_tcg · ‎09-10-2020

some of your shipping is too expensive

Yeah I knew my shipping was way too expensive when I first started since I didn't really know how shipping worked. I recently started using ChitChats express instead of Canada Post, but I just haven't had a chance to update prices. After I settle this phone situation I'm taking a break to focus on uni, then I'll look at the shipping rates chart you made. Thank you!

stardust_tcg · ‎09-10-2020

Did you ever get an explanation from the post office why they couldn’t deliver it to to that address the first time? Also,,,you said you cancelled the redelivery? Why? If it was delivered then the claim would be closed.

I cancelled the redelivery since the buyer told me the package was ineligible when they tried to submit the form. Also it seemed like USPS put it in my name rather than the buyer's. Then when I called on Tuesday I was told it would have been ineligible either way. That's when I found out the address was for a business. Sorry I should have said this in the original post, too many things swimming in my mind atm.

clemowbooks · ‎09-10-2020

"Too expensive" usually means your price is not in line with Canada Post (or USPS + chitchat's fee).

Here are a couple of bookmarks that may help you when you get back to eBay.

https://www.canadapost.ca/cpotools/apps/far/business/findARate?execution=e1s1

https://postcalc.usps.com/Calculator/Index

Have good university term. Stay safe.

stardust_tcg · ‎09-10-2020

Update: I've been talking with PP and so far they're on the buyer's side but after doing some more research on the freight forwarder I've found out that they've been closed for a while now. This info should hopefully convince them to take my side.