sending items valued at over CAN $2000 to the U.K./Europe

[williamf6194]

Hi.

Has anyone experience of sending an item(s) valued at over $2000.00 Canadian to say the U.K. or Europe as a non-business seller? New legislation came into force in 2020 with the Canada Border Services Agency requiring on-line submission of an export declaration rather than the original paper declaration (understandably to cut-down on person to person contact at CBSA during the height of covid).

It appears that the CBSA  'CERS' system is only set up for business owners, not non-business individuals who want to sell items to the U.K for instance (shipping to the U.S. has different requirements).  Even Canada Post lists the requirement for a CERS declaration, but does not have a link to the correct declaration form, only to the CBSA web-site, as the CBSA  is the authority of course.  I have goods (as a non-business ebay.ca seller) valued at over $2000.00 Canadian to sell to the U.K.  It seems that without the declaration, CBSA will not permit the item(s) to leave Canada.  I spent 4 hours on the phone with the CBSA, and was passed from department to department with no one being able to advise me on the correct non-business procedure to allow me to ship my items abroad.  I have an email into the Technical Section of CBSA, but of course the slow-down has delayed any response, but note that as of Saturday, the strike action is allayed.  My courier (DHL in this instance) is not allowed to offer legal advice - instead referring me to the CBSA.  I have been going round in circles with this, and it seems to be a 'Catch 22'.  I don't need a business licence, and do not wish to pay for the cost incurred with setting one up - possibly for this one-time over $2000 limit sale.  Also I would be required to have a business listed with the CRA which I don't require. Does anyone have experience of this problem as a non-business ebay seller?  This new CERS requirement has been around at least since October 2020. Thank you.

Cheers wf

[recped]

Getting a Business Number for import/export is a very simple process that you can do online or by phone. Back in the day before the online system was available it only took a couple of minutes on the phone to get the number and of course there is no cost to do so. Sounds like the online version is even easier.

https://www.canada.ca/en/revenue-agency/services/tax/businesses/topics/registering-your-business/reg...

When you register just makes sure you are getting an "RM" number (import/export) as opposed to an "RT" number which would be for GST/HST.

https://www.canada.ca/en/revenue-agency/services/tax/businesses/topics/registering-your-business/reg...

The $2000 threshold applies to ALL exports to ALL destinations and to ALL exporters regardless is they are an actual business or an individual, anyone can obtain an RM Business Number.

FYI - None of this has anything to do with Covid, the old paper form system was done away with in 2017 (suprised it was still available then).

For a shipment of that value you should also include a proper Customs Invoice (CI1) to ensure smooth clearance in the destination country. You can create one of these online:

https://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/publications/forms-formulaires/ci1-eng.html

[reallynicestamps]

If you are selling, you are a business.

You may not be a profitable one, and you probably don't need to register to collect sales taxes yet (the usual minimum given in $30,000 gross), but if you are planning to sell as an important income stream you should be writing a business plan and consulting a tax accountant familiar with online selling.

If you are a first time seller.

Do not ship internationally.

Do not sell anything that will hurt to lose (financially or emotionally).

Think but don't overthink.

The UK site in accordance with UK laws makes a difference between business and private sellers. The Canada site does not.

If you are registered here, you can still list on the UK site.

But.

See Do not Ship Internationally above.

[williamf6194]

Hello Recped.

Many thanks for your reply and advice.  Even though CBSA had started a go-slow on or about the time I had posted my message (all over now thankfully), they did get back to me fairly quickly.  A very helpful lady at CBSA provided a NDR number for a non-restricted shipment to the U.K. (confirmed by their  export technical policy team), and the courier company was fully satisfied with this and I really didn't require a business number for this transaction for goods over $2000.00.  Just to advise that (thank you for the links) I did apply for a business number from CRA before I heard back from the CBSA, but on receiving a business number from CRA and entering it into the CERS portal - it didn't work.  I have not been able to enter the  CERS portal to this date.

Also - water under the bridge now - but the use of a paper declaration (Form B13A) was actually eliminated on June 30th, 2020 making electronic reporting mandatory.  Presumably, paper declarations were still permitted up to that date (or so it seems), so no idea if it was a long-time coming or due to covid restrictions (CBSA Memorandum D20-1-1)?   Even the courier company I chose (DHL) referenced the need to fill in Form B13A so I had to advise them that this was now out of date since 2020! The CAED electronic method was deleted on Sept. 30th/2020 and replaced by CERS (not to be confused with the CRA CERS programme!).

Anyway, my parcels have been delivered to their final destination safely, with no call back from Canada or the U.K. Border Services.  I would just suggest that if any non-business registered ebay seller in Canada finds themselves in a similar situation of requiring a declaration as their product is over $2000.00 (Canadian), that they contact the CBSA Technical Commercial Client Unit at 1-888-957-7224 and choose option #2, to obtain advice on the correct legal declaration of their goods.  Cheers WF

Cheers

WF

[mr.special-editions]

@reallynicestamps  good post

I will elaborate on the $30,000 threshold and on getting a tax consultant.

 If you sell more than $30,000 in goods and services over the course of a one year period, in most cases you are required under Canadian tax laws to register with the CRA.  eBay/PayPal send all your revenue to the CRA and if you come under audit you will have to prove that the amount wasn't all profit and if you are over $30,000 simply telling the CRA 'I didn't know' will not work out to well.  When you register you then have to collect tax on every sale in Canada and remit that tax to the CRA.  You can choose how you do that, monthly, quarterly, yearly. 

$30,000 gross sales is not $30,000 profit.  Your gross is calculated from your goods and services.  For example you sell an item and charge shipping.  Item = goods Shipping = Service.  To calculate your gross you take the amount you sold the item for, the shipping cost and add them together.  If you sell an item for $90 and charged $10 shipping your gross on that sale is $100.  You do not subtract any ebay fees, item costs, expenses from that amount.  Add up all your sales that way, if you find your gross near $30,000 and you would rather not register with the CRA then stop selling until next year.  If you find yourself over that amount you should contact a tax consulant for advice.  If you are WAY above that amount, you NEED an accountant and a competent one.

The problem with getting an accountant and a good one is first they can be very expensive.  The second issue is finding one that knows online sales or is willing to learn it.  The reason you want an accountant is because they will speak on your behalf to the CRA.  If you have an accountant, you authorize them to speak on your behalf if the CRA contacts you, all you need to say is 'at the advice of my accountant I cannot speak to you, you may speak with him/her this is there name and number' (its like having a lawyer)

You should keep your eBay sales (your business) seperate from your personal bank, credit cards etc.  If you keep them seperate the CRA can only look at your business.  If you have failed to do that an audit could be extremely messy, painful, bankrupt you and even get you into legal trouble.

Lastly an audit can come at anytime, meaning the CRA can audit you for previous years.  They can only go back so far (I believe around 5 years) however if they find enough tax issues they can go back even further.

It sounds scary but there's a HUGE upside to selling as a registered business and claiming ITCs.  Especially if you do a lot of international sales.  If done properly you make more money.