Can someone please explain how the Resolution Center works?

[ciny2k]

I'm not understanding how it works, exactly. 

I bought an item that was defective. I liked the seller, and had already left positive feedback, since I didn't notice the problem when I first received it. The seller was going to send me a substitute, and I was going to pay for the shipping. Except, the substitute seemed to have 'gone missing' and I was left hanging. I decided to go the Resolution Center route because the seller seemed to be ignoring me and I was out $70 at this point - $35 for the item, and the rest shipping/Pitney Bowes international charges. 

So, now the seller is offering me a refund. Great, but it's only $35.  Do I have to swallow the rest? Or will Paypal refund me the rest? Does this affect the seller's reputation at all? I couldn't find any of these questions answered on the site itself, so any help clearing things up for me is greatly appreciated. Thanks! 

[marnotom!]

From what we've been able to piece together about the resolution process when it relates to Global Shipping Program items, your best course of action would be to let PayPal deal with the entire refund.  The seller may or may not be "protected" in this case as they used the GSP, but that's not your concern.

[ciny2k]

Thank you for your response. I just didn't know if I should go ahead and accept the refund and then wait for Paypal to refund the extra charges or not. From what I've read it sounds like once I take the offer, then it's closed and I'm out the fees. But the seller is honest enough to offer a full refund. I've contacted paypal with my question, so I guess I'll wait for their instructions. 

[marnotom!]

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@ciny2k wrote:

Thank you for your response. I just didn't know if I should go ahead and accept the refund and then wait for Paypal to refund the extra charges or not. From what I've read it sounds like once I take the offer, then it's closed and I'm out the fees. But the seller is honest enough to offer a full refund. I've contacted paypal with my question, so I guess I'll wait for their instructions. 

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Not all sellers using the GSP are completely aware of how it works.  Your seller may be unaware of the extra shipping and import charges you had to pay to the Global Shipping Program as he never sees those.  He may have the best of intentions at heart, but he may not realize that offering a "full refund" means he'll be returning money to you that you never gave him in the first place.

You're correct that once the claim is closed, in theory it can't be reopened.  I would give the process a chance to do its stuff if you want the best chance possible of recovering the charges levied by PitneyBowes.

[reallynicestamps]

Normally, when a Dispute is opened, the seller can clean it up by refunding immediately and voluntarily.

I hope, for the seller's sake, that this still is true. He does seem willing to refund the payment he recieved. As you know, he never saw any part of the GSP charges, which were handled by PitneyBowes/GSP.

While sellers detest having Disputes opened against them, in this case it is probably the simplest way and, fingers crossed, will cause no harm to the seller.

[ciny2k]

Thank you for your input. So far I've only received the 'form letter' type of replies from paypal, so I'm still very uncertain as to how I should proceed.  It seems strange to go right to making a claim when the seller is offering a refund on the purchase price. I think that's a fair offer - but it's not really a benefit to me since I'm out twice that. 

The other issue about making the claim is that I actually purchased 3 items from this seller and the paypal resolution center doesn't seem to itemize purchases, so all 3 are lumped together as the claim. That's incorrect - I don't want to escalate to claim when the dollar value isn't reflecting the actual item. That's really unfair!

[ciny2k]

reallynicestamps, thanks for your input too. Will this hurt the seller? I don't want it to affect them at all, since I'm ok with fact that I was sent defective product - and having a substitute sent out seemed like a good option at the time.

[reallynicestamps]

Disputes and claims are part of a seller's record. One way to end the dispute is prompt correction of the problem, usually a refund although some sellers will send replacements to satisfy their customers.

When the seller voluntarily does this, the case closes and there is no Black Mark on the seller's account.

If a seller does not refund voluntarily, PP will refund the customer and go after the seller. And there is a note on the seller's account.

Yes, eBay does monitor sellers quite closely. Those Black Marks can mean loss of TRS discounts, restriction of ability to list or even removal from the site.

Personally, I don't like accepting replacements rather than refunds. While most sellers (and buyers) are honest, replacements take time to arrive and may be no better than the original item. I'd rather end the original transaction with a refund and then re-order if I believe we just had bad luck with the original purchase. It happens.

[ciny2k]

Thanks for explaining things  - although I'm still unsure of how to proceed. The substitution was my idea since the dollar value was the same and it seemed like an easy fix. Or could have been. I did explain to the seller that sending it through GSP wasn't the best way to do it, and considering I've bought the same item and had it shipped USPS without any troubles, for a much lower price (and keeping those jobs alive, sorry - another peeve of mine, lol - don't mind me) I know that the seller is aware of the costs involved on my end. 

Argh, the seller is willing to refund the price, so I should accept the offer? I don't want this to be a black mark by refusing the offer and escalating to claim. I also don't think it's fair that my cost is twice the amount because of the fees involved. There must be a way to have this money reimbursed without making things tough on the seller? 

[marnotom!]

I get the impression that eBay and PitneyBowes (The GSP administrator) are still working out some of the kinks in the GSP's return process.  As a result, you're presently dealing with a set of established automated routines for "regular" claims that probably have to be embellished with some manual inputs and overrides to accommodate the GSP's sundry charges.

As far as I'm concerned, you did your part by advising the seller that the GSP probably wasn't the best of choices for this sale, but they went ahead with it anyway.  I think your seller has to accept the consequences of that choice.  Having said that, I wouldn't be surprised if your seller won't see any sort of strike for a "no fault" refund forced by the resolution process as this was a GSP sale.

I am confused by the fact that there are "three items lumped into one sale" though.  I was under the impression that it was impossible to combine shipments with the GSP.  Did your seller attempt some fancy mathematical gymnastics here?  😄

At any rate, if the process leads you to having more funds returned to you than necessary, it's a simple matter to "send money" directly to your seller via PayPal and repay them the balance.

[ciny2k]

IDK - the total from the purchases was $110, plus $40 shipping, plus $60 Pitney Bowes. I really have no idea how it works, and I don't want this thread to turn into a GSP debate, lol - lots of them already.  The seller said it was easier to use GSP, but I don't know why exactly. Maybe they do pick ups? I know for myself, it's more convenient to go to the post office than have a courier deliver my goods at any given time. 

[marnotom!]

If you're comfortable sharing the listing number for the defective item, I wouldn't mind having a poke around and seeing what I can find out about how the seller's doing their business.  If you don't want to do that, that's fine.  This is more out of morbid curiosity on my part than anything else, although it may give others some insights into the GSP's invoicing process, which is supposedly out of the seller's hands.

I'm assuming your seller preferred the GSP over direct shipping as it meant that the item could ship just as it would a domestic sale (however the seller does that) and that the shipment is supposed to be tracked (although there have been reports that this aspect of it doesn't always work as it should).  Oh, and they may also like the fact that the GSP is supposed to assume all liability in the event that a shipment is lost or damaged, rather than relying on good old-fashioned insurance to do the job.  Different strokes for different folks, I guess.

[ciny2k]

151157791176 was the problem purchase. 

I'd love for you to poke around - especially if it helps other people deal with these issues. Thanks! 

I did have another seller tell me that they, "Had to use GSP for my sale because I was enrolled in the program."  Which obviously I never asked for this, so that seller sure doesn't know what it's all about. I guess this is a learning experience for everyone. 

[marnotom!]

I can't see anything in the seller's active or completed listings that would lead me to believe that she's doing something that would wreak havoc with the GSP invoicing process as I understand it.

She does have one active listing where the GSP isn't being used, but I don't know if that's a deliberate choice or an accident, and probably has nothing to do with the price of beans anyway.

So to make sure I'm understanding you correctly:  You received only one payment request/invoice for all three items that you purchased from the seller?  And the shipping amount is the total of what was quoted in the listings?

If this is the case, it must be the GSP itself that is combining the items onto one invoice, which I suppose makes sense when you think about it.

[ciny2k]

Yes, that's correct -  it was combined on one invoice. But the items were listed individually, with a single charge for GSP.

But the sales are all lumped together now. Thanks again for checking things out. I have no doubt that the seller is on the  up-and-up and this is just bad luck. 

I think it's giving sellers a bit of a headache because I just purchased 2 items from another seller and they had to contact GSP to get the combined shipping to work. Glitches? 

[ciny2k]

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and please, please, please mods don't move my thread <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

I'm still confused and haven't heard back from paypal and don't know if I should go right to claim with this. The fact that GSP came up at all is only because the seller is in the US and used the program to ship and I'd like to recoup my money spent. Same as returning something at Canadian Tire - I want the purchase price as well as the taxes back. 

[marnotom!]

Yes, escalate your dispute and go through the claims process.  I doubt that PayPal will make any sort of effort to recover your taxes and other import charges otherwise.

Keep in mind that you, your seller, and PayPal are navigating through not very well charted waters right now, so it's really up to guinea pigs cases like yours to help develop the "knowledge base" for staff.

[ciny2k]

Thanks again for taking the time to help me with this,marnotom! I'm still receiving form letter replies at this point. I declined the refund offer but haven't escalated to claim yet. Maybe I'm reading too much into this, but in my mind the whole idea of refusing an offer and escalating to claim implies that the seller isn't co-operating. I think a full refund for SNAD is fair. Although I will have to escalate if paypal doesn't intervene within the time frame given. 

And yes, seller confirmed that the entire sale amount was being held. "Robbery" was the term used, lol. None too happy with me for going this route....sigh....

[marnotom!]

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@ciny2k wrote:

I'm still receiving form letter replies at this point. I declined the refund offer but haven't escalated to claim yet. Maybe I'm reading too much into this, but in my mind the whole idea of refusing an offer and escalating to claim implies that the seller isn't co-operating. I think a full refund for SNAD is fair. Although I will have to escalate if paypal doesn't intervene within the time frame given. 

And yes, seller confirmed that the entire sale amount was being held. "Robbery" was the term used, lol. None too happy with me for going this route....sigh....

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And this is one reason why sellers can no longer leave negative feedback for buyers.

I think you are reading too much into this.  The seller made an offer.  For reasons beyond the seller's control, their offer won't suffice.  I think you should escalate at this point.  You're not likely going to get more than "form messages" while you're still in the dispute stage.  You need an opportunity to explain that you want a refund of the item price and import charges, but not a refund of the whole shebang.

[ciny2k]

Why  can't sellers leave negative feedback for buyers? Kinda OT, but now I'm curious.

 After the seller read my message refusing the offer as well as my reasoning for not escalating to claim, she went ahead and did it.

So we'll see what happens next. It's unfortunate but it's not the end of the world.