Ebay Global Shipping - Intelcom Express Canada Ontario, item shipped to wrong address refund denied

[Anonymous]

Summary: Ordered a Samsung Galaxy  Book 2 Pro 360 off Ebay that was delivered to someone else's home by Intelcom Express (I provided the correct address, Intelcom Express delivered it to a random address). As Intelcom Express delivered it they marked it as "delivered" as part of their tracking. Due to this I have had all my refund attempts denied. The only proof I have is the picture Intelcom Express sent me of the package on the steps of the wrong household (This was not sufficient proof for Ebay).

Note: This house looks nothing like my home, and it's clearly not even in the neighbourhood.

Not really sure what to do about this. If anyone can help me that'd be greatly appreciated. I've tried to get the refund about 3 times, twice over live chat and once over the phone. All three times they said they would refund me but later it would be denied.

See for the messages: https://i.imgur.com/Sba9Q2i.png

You can see they approved the refund a few times then denied it.

As for the proof I have I can provide the whole email but here are pictures of a portion of the email, the house it was delivered to, and my house.

Email Portion: https://i.imgur.com/GBtj1Ui.png

Attached Picture (Wrong House): https://i.imgur.com/yGhTszW.png

My House:  https://i.imgur.com/CCUy6xs.jpeg

The worst thing is Intelcom Express has this in their message

"A package can be delivered without a signature to a location deemed safe by the driver. If the picture attached to the delivery confirmation email looks unfamiliar, please contact the merchant for assistance."

So basically they dropped off a $2000 package at the wrong house. Took a picture, left and marked it as delivered. Ebay provides no help, and Intelcom Express doesn't respond.

What I've tried:

Live chat and calling.

Also contacted Intelcom Express but was left on hold for over 6 hours so I gave up and emailed them. No response after 7 days.

Contacted Ebay again and now I've received no updates for just about 7 days

At this point I don't really expect anything but I'd love some help with this if anyone can help. For anyone that orders in Ontario I highly recommend never ordering from Ebay due to the off chance you get Intelcom Express.

So far the end result for me is no laptop and missing $2000. And over 2 weeks of headache

[femmefan1946]

recommend never ordering from Ebay due to the off chance you get Intelcom Express.

The SELLER chose to use the Global Shipping Program.

GSP chose to use Intelcom.

Which I agree seems to have even more unhappy comments than any other last mile shipper.

jasmen@ebay 

Another complaint for the GSP list.

The trick is to avoid, not eBay, but sellers who choose to use GSP, since the seller has no control over that last mile shipper.

The seller herself chooses to use GSP as a Seller Protection because she is paranoid and xenophobic, and the GSP relieves her of responsibility for delivery  after the purchase reaches the GSP plant in Erlanger KY, and she doesn't have to deal with us dangerous and crooked furriners.

As to your actual problem @Anonymous  you may find help with the real eBay employees who cover eBay's social media accounts.


https://community.ebay.com/t5/Selling/How-do-I-contact-Customer-Support/m-p/32016431#M1783851
https://twitter.com/askebay?lang=en



https://www.facebook.com/eBayForBusiness/ — Message button in upper right on landing page.

Avoid the phones. Those are subcontracted out to a company in Utah. And those Utah accents are horrendous.

[Anonymous]

Thanks @femmefan1946 !

I've contacted them via facebook as I already have through https://community.ebay.com/t5/Selling/How-do-I-contact-Customer-Support/m-p/32016431#M1783851.

Hopefully I have better luck there.

[Anonymous]

It looks like eBay has given up on providing support unfortunately: https://i.imgur.com/bOWtken.png

After this horrible customer support experience I can safely say no one should ever use eBay not just because of the fact that the GSP is clearly a horrendous program but because the support has no care for their customers and makes 0 effort to actually provide help. The fact that all it takes is the delivery company to mark it as "Delivered" and you never see your product or money again is ridiculous. Especially when they provide photo proof they delivered it to the wrong address.

I could rant on and on about this but at this point it looks like I can do is bring this to small claims court. Thanks for all the help @femmefan1946 

[marnotom!]

@Anonymous, I appreciate this is upsetting if not infuriating, but the rep you chatted with is correct.  There's a procedure that eBay goes through when investigating a claim of an item not delivered.  Since your item shows up on Intelcom's website as having been delivered to your city, it's met the criteria for successful delivery.  If Intelcom used addresses and/or postal codes in its tracking, the outcome of your case may have been different.

When the rep mentioned the possibility of your using means outside of eBay to assist with recovering your funds, I don't think they meant a small claims suit.  I'm hoping you used the most powerful way to pay for your item, which would have been with a credit card.  If so, your next step should be contacting your credit card issuer, letting them know that you didn't receive an item you ordered online, and you can't work things out with the merchant.  Ask your credit card issuer to initiate a charge dispute--more commonly referred to as a "chargeback"--for the unreceived item. 

Chargebacks can sometimes take a while to process so don't expect instant results.  Keep in mind that your photographic evidence isn't all that great as it doesn't show your address on the package and it might be just something the Intelcom driver had on their phone at the time or they sent the wrong photo to you.  What will, I hope, be the weakness in Intelcom's case is that their tracking information doesn't show more precisely where the item was delivered, but I can't be certain of that.

Finally, while the Global Shipping Program has a lot of weaknesses, I think your beef is more with Intelcom than with the Program itself.  If a private seller had used Intelcom to send an item directly to you and this happened, the outcome of your case would likely have been the same.

Keep us posted, and good luck.

[Anonymous]

I can safely say my beef is with eBay itself.

Not only was I teased a refund 3 times with actual emails saying my refund is "approved" and being "process" to wait X hours. They've also made close to zero effort themselves and fail to make any further attempts at assistance. Don't forget they continually ghost me whenever a new case is started. I have a case with Logistics and after providing the last piece of evidence they've disappeared for 7 days.

I have no issue with the reps. They follow company procedure as you've said, they're correct, they're just doing their job. However eBay as a whole is a horrible experience that no human being should have to go through.

No customer should have to go what I'm going through right now. The worst thing is the fact that this is eBay's program as you stated. It's their Global Shipping Program which makes them even MORE responsible from my point of view.

Yes Intelcom Express is absolutely horrible. But at least they've shined the light at how bad eBay really is which turns out they're equally as bad if not worse. Intelcom express also has the decency to give me zero hope and provide zero support, why does eBay like stringing along it's customers? No point in existing if you don't make any effort.

Regardless of if I get my money back or not I think it's safe to say I'll never use eBay again which is extremely unfortunate as before this experience everything was dandy.

[marnotom!]

The Global Shipping Program is actually run by Pitney Bowes, the struggling behemoth that was once a major force in the postal meter industry.  They bought a logistics company in an attempt to diversify and stay afloat. but they're still far from the post war glory days.

You've been a member of eBay for over a decade.  In that time you should have picked up a pretty good sense of how the site operates.  If I were in your situation, I'd know that I'd have a serious fight on my hands with the online "proof" eBay had from Intelcom of delivery, and I'd also know that they wouldn't have considered a photo of an unlabelled package on a random doorstep that could have been taken by anybody to be proof of anything.

I'm sure that this wasn't the first rodeo for some of the eBay staff dealing with your case.  A buyer with a limited amount of feedback in over ten years of eBay making a claim like this for a high-ticket item would probably raise some red flags.  On the other hand, Intelcom seems to leave its delivery operations in the hands of undertrained and underpaid contractees or gig-economy types and you may have ended up with one who's figured out how to beat the system.  eBay's really between a rock and a hard place here.  I suspect your "refund granted" emails were probably automatically generated with a few keyclicks by staffers who didn't grasp that the carrier had provided "proof of delivery" and that when the claim went to Pitney Bowes, it was kicked back for that reason.

You mention a "case with Logistics" out of the blue.  I have no idea how this works, if you're dealing with eBay or Pitney Bowes on this, and what sort of "evidence" and other communication you've provided.  I note that my point about credit card chargebacks went ignored.  I'm sorry if I'm sounding pretty brutal here, but I'm trying to be even-handed.  As is often the case with stuff like this brought to the discussion boards, I think there's more to this story than we're getting here. 

[Anonymous]

I'm not sure your role with eBay. By no means did I "Ignore" your credit card chargebacks. I simply responded with the fact that my beef is solely with eBay. We could go on for days.

The support was extremely poor and should never go as far as it has. That's simply a fact.

The issue is there isn't anything more to the story.

It's as simple as the story was stated. Intelcom Express delivers package to wrong address, takes a picture and marks it as delivered. Ergo an eBay buyer can never get a refund for said delivery.

Do you not see anything wrong with that? Why is this not addressed? It's disgusting

I understand human error, does eBay not understand it? Clearly Intelcom Express made a human error but no one acknowledges the possibility of it. It's extremely dissapointing.

And no you're not being brutal but you're not addressing everything in the exact same way. Just like how I didn't address the credit card chargeback. The reality is I used a debit visa where processing a refund is less likely than going to small claims.

It's very weak to claim "there's more to this story". Anyone in Ontario can tell you how intelcom express operates. They deliver a package and take a picture. Unfortunately my delivery driver delivered it to the incorrect address, the only thing that's fortunate is they took a picture. Which in theory should serve as clear evidence but does not.

You can defend eBay as much as you want but it's extremely clear the customer support is garbage for cases like this. Attacking me and/or my case because I've stated that the support here is not good is not a good way to go around things.

As for the case with "Logistics" this was with eBay over the phone. Don't know where that went as I received one email and they stopped responding afterwards. Why did they stop responding? Because the customer service is extremely poor.

And it's very clear no matter how you comment you have an extreme bias to eBay and you won't see my side. And that's fine, I just don't see why you have to attack weak points like "ignored chargeback", "more to this story". There isn't anything. That's it. This is the whole story. Intelcom Express does a poor job delivering, and eBay support makes no effort to accomadate for this.

The thing is anyone put in my situation only has one piece of evidence. And that's Intelcom Expresses picture proof of delivery. NO ONE will be able to provide more evidence when put in this situation because the problem is so simple.

We can both agree this is a **bleep**ty situation I hope.

The only thing at this point that you're commenting on is the fact that I've stated my beef solely lies with eBay. Because again, their customer support is the absolute worst.

[Anonymous]

I do appreciate the suggestions you both provided, messaging via Facebook was great but didn't pan out. Credit Card chargeback is good but won't work due to the card I used. I wish I used PayPal as well but that's not an option either unfortunately. Listen you can attack everything where I went wrong cause that's clearly the motive and you're absolutely right, I made a lot of poor decisions due to not knowing.

But this case which is what should be the sole discussion is based on one thing, and that's the fact that Intelcom Express sent a photo of the delivery at the wrong house.

I'm well aware that you probably don't believe it with how much you love eBay. And sure whatever, but I'm sure you believe it's possible yes? So how about the next guy that gets put in the exact same situation? That's the thing, the exact same thing will happen, they'll be put through the ringer with eBay support and provided no assistance. Why? Because Intelcom express marks it as delivere despite providing a photo of the incorrect house. Where does this leave the buyer? Well he's missing money and the product he purchased.

So where does that leave the conclusion of what I've said? Simple... don't buy on eBay. The support won't help you when you get thrown into this situation. So why would anyone use eBay if they didn't have to?

I'm simply stating my experience when I say eBay support is the absolute worst.

It's clear you can't help me anymore, it sounds like no one can. So before you attack everything I just said.

Please answer me these questions.

1. Do you believe what happened to me is possible, that human error by a delivery driver caused this?

2. If so what is someone to do when put in this situation? Where the only evidence they have is an email with photo proof of an incorrect delivery.

Because it's going to happen to someone and I don't want them to be put in the same situation. Maybe this'll help someone out in the future.

And if you don't believe this actually happened then simply comment that and move on. Because we're not doing eachother any favours by typing out essays with heavy biases due to different experiences. You've had a good experience with eBay, I have not. We can leave it at that. But I really hope there's a small sliver that you have a little hope in humanity that a stranger online could be telling the truth and the big corporation is failing to deliver support. Regardless I hope you continue to have a good experience, I will have to search for that elsewhere.

[marnotom!]

---

@Anonymous wrote:

I do appreciate the suggestions you both provided, messaging via Facebook was great but didn't pan out. Credit Card chargeback is good but won't work due to the card I used. I wish I used PayPal as well but that's not an option either unfortunately. Listen you can attack everything where I went wrong cause that's clearly the motive and you're absolutely right, I made a lot of poor decisions due to not knowing.

---

A credit card chargeback may not be an option for you, but a debit card chargeback might be.  I've found references to this process in reference to American and British debit card holders.  It's murkier for Canadian card holders, though, but you might want to do some digging on both the VISA Canada website and your card issuer's website.  Here's a bit of information on the "VISA E-Promise" to get you started:

https://www.visa.ca/en_CA/pay-with-visa/security.html#3

I will admit that some Canadian financial institutions appear to be pretty reluctant to deal with chargebacks for online purchases, though.  I had a tough time getting one for some stuff my wife ordered but not even shipped out by the seller, but I eventually prevailed.

---

@Anonymous wrote:

But this case which is what should be the sole discussion is based on one thing, and that's the fact that Intelcom Express sent a photo of the delivery at the wrong house.

---

Somebody claiming to work for Intelcom or an agent of Intelcom sent you a picture of an unlabelled package on somebody's front steps.  We don't know if it's your package or if it's a photo that the person who sent it to you has had on their phone for ages.  We don't even know where it's located, although the geographical coordinates might be attached to the original picture.  I don't have much in the way of information attached to the uploaded version.

Unfortunately, it's merely evidence that someone is capable of taking a picture.

---

@Anonymous wrote:

Please answer me these questions.

1. Do you believe what happened to me is possible, that human error by a delivery driver caused this?

2. If so what is someone to do when put in this situation? Where the only evidence they have is an email with photo proof of an incorrect delivery.

---

Right now I'm trying to approach this with as open a mind as possible.  There are a number of possible scenarios here.  But the one thing I'm pretty certain about is that the photograph you received is not proof of anything, unfortunately, but it might be evidence of some sort of wrong-doing once more puzzle pieces are first put in place.

As you noted earlier, eBay customer service helped you as best as possible given the parameters they have to work with.  I have no idea why you received the "claim approved" or "refund approved" emails that you did.  I only know that a lot of eBay's processes are automated and glitch-prone.

Online viewable proof of delivery to the address or city provided by the buyer to eBay is a cornerstone of seller protection.  It's the only way that sellers are able to prevail in most fraudulent claims of non-delivery and claims of credit card fraud.  Take that sort of protection away and you're going to see sellers leaving eBay in droves.

[marnotom!]

I should have added that if a VISA debit card chargeback is not possible, your next step might have to be filing a police report.  In fact, you may be asked to do this as part of the chargeback process.

[femmefan1946]

The reality is I used a debit visa where processing a refund is less likely than going to small claims.

Don't ever pay online with a debit card.

This is the electronic equivalent of paying with a personal cheque, since the money comes from your bank account.

It is irretrievable once cashed.

For the same reason, never buy online with a gift card.

The Global Shipping Program is a SELLER PROTECTION program.

It offers almost nothing to buyers and less to Canadian  buyers since we have a strong bond between Canada Post and USPS which is reliable and speedy.

EBay sellers have been claiming for years that we are eBay's customers, while buyers are the customers of us sellers. The premise being that we pay to advertise on this site and pay to have our customers' payments processed.  If you can accept that (personally I think things are a little more nuanced) then the GSP is exactly designed to help eBay's customers.

But Intelcom is pants.

[gear88dust]

ONLY Buyer brings real dough $$  into this equation, otherwise eBay + Seller can advertise for free all day long !  This philosophy to protect buyer owe existence of whole eBay experience !

This current reversed idea of seller being eBays number one client and buyer become sellers customer with  headache & burden  is the last eBays NAIL in the coffin !

In other words So Long eBay and Welcome to Amazon !