eBay

bradgalley · ‎05-09-2020

Anyone know how to contact the Global shipping centre in Erlanger Kentucky?

lotzofuniquegoodies · ‎05-10-2020

@bradgalley @

As per femmefan1946 it would be the Mother of Pearl handle that's causing the problems. See list attached.

https://shopping.myus.com/shipping/restrictions/

Section:

Animal, Reptile, Horticultural & Agricultural Items

Mother of Pearl items commonly found on watches, guitars, and jewelry items

If the requirements are not followed by the shipper, the item gets stopped. It appears in this situation the seller did not do their due diligence.

-Lotz

bradgalley · ‎05-10-2020

The scales are not Mother of Pearl. It is just how they have always been described by Dubl Duck the manufacturer. They are just celluloid, an older form of plastic with a crackled effect that imitates the effect of Mother of Pearl. But I guess I can't expect a minimum wage worker in Kentucky to know that. Still, it is unfortunate that there can be no recourse or dialogue between the buyer and those who incorrectly deem an item restricted when it is not. But since they give no reason or explanation in their message I can only guess as to their motives. All I know is my item was incorrectly marked restricted, I don't get my item, they get to sell it at a profit, and I got reimbursed less than what I paid. Sooo.. yeah.. I'm shrugging my shoulders at this point.

femmefan1946 · ‎05-10-2020

Then how do you suggest I get my item with out Pitney Bowes further profiting from my loss?

Once you got the refund, you are no longer the owner.

Will it be returned or will they sell it for profit?

I've never heard of PB returning disputed items to the seller, who was also paid (by you) for it and is no longer the owner.

When PB sells it, they may or may not make a profit.

They may pay to have a truckload of damaged, illegal or unsaleable stuff (perhaps including the disputed razor) taken to the dump each day.

They may sell it at a loss after all their expenses.

They may sell it for a profit.

The point is that, chagrined as you may be, you are not the owner, you have been refunded (pace foreign exchange), and you will probably never see it again.

tyler@ebay · ‎05-11-2020

@femmefan1946 wrote:

I believe both you and the seller are refunded.

tyler@ebay Am I right on that?

Then the item belongs to PitneyBowes/GSP, just as after a fire, the contents of a burnt out business belongs to the fire insurance company.

I doubt it is the "mother of pearl" since that is not a material restricted under the CITES agreements. More likely it is the fact that it is a razor, which can be construed as a weapon. Canada is strict about that, although the GSP minion may have over-reacted.

Hi @femmefan1946 - yes, in the case of a restricted/disallowed item the seller is allowed to keep the money they received, and the buyer is refunded.

@bradgalley - I'm sorry that this item isn't going to make it to you, but I'm glad that you got a refund of the purchase price already! Typically you'll see the refund of the Global Shipping fees as a separate refund come through a bit later. Thanks!

Tyler,

15westcoast · ‎05-11-2020

The Global Shipping Program has several "buzz" words that will result in you having

your item not forwarded to Canada. "Stag" "Mother of Pearl" Any reference to " Ivory" even

if the description say "ivory Like". I have been this route and have had three knives not forwarded

because of this. These knives are perfectly legal in Canada. Had the seller shipped by USPS and

not through the GSP I would have received them. I no longer bid on any items if the seller is on

the GSP. Besides, it adds a week or more on the wait to receive your items as it is sent across

the country to Kentucky and forwarded from there. A very flawed system to say the least.

15westcoast · ‎05-11-2020

Re: My previous post on the GSP. I did receive a refund for the items that were

not forwarded ( it took a while). The lasting bad taste is that two of the items were

scarce and no longer available. So, I was out a couple of unique purchases for my

collection. So, I no longer bid on GSP items. Very sad.

femmefan1946 · ‎05-11-2020

The Global Shipping Program is a Seller Protection system that offers very little for buyers.

The seller is guaranteed to get paid and to escape phoney Not Delivered claims and most "damaged in transit" claims.

It does allow non-US buyers access to more listings, and can actually be cheaper when duty and sales taxes are paid, if the purchase is large and high value, because shipping is done en masse using a manifest rather than single shipments.

But low value? small? and to Canada? Doesn't usually go all that well.

marnotom! · ‎05-11-2020

@lotzofuniquegoodies wrote:

How many Sellers and Buyers know all the rules, verbatim? I'm imagining a manual the size of War and Peace...Triple spaced!!

No need to know the rules "verbatim". I don't know all the ins and outs of international selling, but I think I get the gist of it and know when to consult the "rules" when I'm in doubt about something or I need more details.

International law says something to the effect that importers are responsible for ensuring that the items they import are allowed to enter the country legally. I don't think it takes much more effort for buyers/importers to ensure that the carrier of their choice will be able to get their item to them--legal or not--and what possible complications there might be. (I'm thinking along the lines of steep brokerage fees for FedEx and UPS ground shipments from the US, for instance.)

@lotzofuniquegoodies wrote:

The seller "should" know in advance of listing an item, if it is allowed. A flag or something. And if a seller does make a mistake as per I believe it was last Springs /ca/com Announcement the seller was supposed to be given a chance to fix. No harm no foul. Did that kick in? It doesn't sound like it. As for the buyer, they would possibly deduce if their item is banned when they can't find anywhere on eBay. Instead the system is: Let it get to PB and then stop it in its tracks. Sounds like setting them(buyer/seller) up to fail.

Remember, the selling point of the GSP is to make international selling as straightforward for US (and UK) sellers as domestic sales. Once you start asking sellers to ensure that their items conform to the requirements of the program, that adds another layer to their selling that isn't present for domestic-only sales. And from what I've been able to see, sellers using the GSP aren't subject to a set of terms and conditions the way their potential buyers are, which makes a bit of sense when you're thinking about it, as buyers are they ones paying for this program, not sellers. And I don't know about you or anybody else, but if I'm paying as much as I'm paying to use this program, I'm going to figure out the basics of this program to make sure I'm getting my money's worth.

@lotzofuniquegoodies wrote:

It should be eBay's responsibility to "coach" sellers properly and not just collect fees and/or not be so fast to jump the gun when they do make a slip up. It would be nice if every seller knew every rule in the eBay playbook. That's not going to happen. Those rules change depending on which CS you speak to on any given day or where your search words accidentally lead you. Trying to stay on top of all the rules in eBay is a nightmare even for the veterans on here.

And what brick and mortar retailer knows every rule in the book and has been thoroughly coached in the ins and outs of retailing? None, I suspect.

I used to like everything spelt out in detail before going forward, too, but like you, I realized that was too onerous and I had to make allowances for learning by trial and error. I also figured out that what I thought was "rule following" was actually "following best practices" and I avoided a lot of trouble that way.

@lotzofuniquegoodies wrote:

One set of rules if its sold without GSP. A different set of rules if its sold with GSP. Restricted items would come up banned when a seller tried to list them in either case. Not helping in all this mess is a very large majority of sellers are now using GSP. Signed up without knowing the grief it causes or maybe opted in without their knowledge. This is why whenever anyone comes in here with a recent horror story about another item either delayed or stopped in its tracks our first response is tell them to avoid GSP at all costs or the alternative, that it is truly only best suited for SOME items. Until there are easy to use filters for buyers to avoid GSP, we will continue seeing these upset, confused, annoyed customers trying to find out why their whatchamacallit is stuck in PB Purgatory.

Let's take perfume. It's a perfectly legal item, we're confronted with it when we walk into our local Shoppers Drug Mart. It's pretty much all manufactured outside of Canada, so it's getting into the country somehow. People assume that because they see it in the drugstore, it should be straightforward to order it online and get it shipped to them from France by express mail. Not so fast. Perfume is lumped into the Universal Postal Union's "dangerous goods" category. It's not illegal, but it can't (well, shouldn't) be shipped by express air mail, either. Perhaps it can be shipped by surface, but for consistency's sake, the postal service just says "non".

The GSP restrictions are for items that can't be forwarded via the GSP. The items may be legal to have in Canada, they may be illegal, they may be against eBay regulations anyway, but they are what they are. And, like it or not, it's up to buyers to ensure that they comply with them.

Maybe it's the Gen-X'er in me, but I think the crux of the matter is that we've been brainwashed into thinking that online shopping is a fabulous "new wave" of shopping experience that's simply a virtual approximation of brick and mortar shopping but somehow more convenient. The reality is that it's not necessarily more convenient and it's more like a throwback to the good ol' days when we ordered stuff out of catalogues.

https://twitter.com/i/status/1216038056572211203

marnotom! · ‎05-11-2020

@bradgalley wrote:

I got my refund this morning. It was less then what I paid. Lol

If you got all your GSP-related fees from Pitney Bowes refunded, I'd chalk that up to the very bumpy ride the Canadian dollar's been getting in the past month or so. I'm probably going to be facing something similar; I purchased an item from a seller in Pittsburgh that I'm likely going to have to return and my refund is likely going to work out to be less than what I paid once the refund is converted to Canadian dollars.

marnotom! · ‎05-11-2020

@femmefan1946 wrote:

Then how do you suggest I get my item with out Pitney Bowes further profiting from my loss?

Once you got the refund, you are no longer the owner.

For what it's worth, I recalled the GSP terms and conditions mentioning something about title to an item forwarded through the item, and I found in section 9 it states that title to an item forwarded by the program remains with the seller until it's delivered.

bradgalley · ‎05-11-2020

I have spoken with Ebay, Pitney Bowes, customs, both Canadian and American, and the seller who is also looking for answers. I have made progress. The razor is not restricted and should never have been conclusively marked as such. It may take a few days but I may get an explanation. A case is being opened and an investigation is to be done. I'm hoping for the best.

marnotom! · ‎05-12-2020

@bradgalley wrote:

I have spoken with Ebay, Pitney Bowes, customs, both Canadian and American, and the seller who is also looking for answers. I have made progress. The razor is not restricted and should never have been conclusively marked as such. It may take a few days but I may get an explanation. A case is being opened and an investigation is to be done. I'm hoping for the best.

Wow, that's pretty impressive. That must have taken a while, as I'm sure call centres are running on a skeleton staff right now and you were probably on hold for some time waiting to talk to someone.

What sort of claim did you file and with whom?

bradgalley · ‎05-12-2020

Although it took me most of the day It actually wasn't that bad getting through. I had to call Pitney Bowes Canada to get the correct number for Pitney Bowes U.S. because the one I originally found on thier site sent me to a pharmaceutical company. The Canadian rep I spoke to was very helpful and gave me the name of a Man who she deals with who handles the shipping from Erlanger Kentucy to Canada, who she said could likely sort out my problem but after getting the runaround through different departments none of the U.S. reps where able (or willing) to transfer me to the shipping department where he works. So after gathering information from Customs and Pitney bowes I had Ebay call me back since they have reopened thier call centers and spoke to a rep that was much more helpful then the previous reps I was only able to text with. After a long conversation and getting nowhere because to his own admission floor reps have very little ability or access to information regarding Erlanger Kentucy I simply asked to be transferred to somebody that does have access. This is when he told me that there is another department with greater jurisdiction within Ebay but I cannot be transferred there unless a case is open. He said just to open a simple "item not arrived" case and outlined the process of doing so. I have not opened the case yet because it involves the seller and I wanted his permission first before doing so. I messaged him last night and an hour ago recieved his blessing and full participation as he also wants answers. The rep told me that after I open the case with the information I have they will send an email to the seller and after he responds with collaborating information I can call Ebay and then be transferred to this "other" department. Now I admit, I may be going down a rabbit hole but I have questions I want answered, why was it marked restricted? Will it be resold and if so by who so I can have the original seller repurchase it? Will it be destroyed? I just want to know what has happened so this doesn't happen again. I understand the naysayers with thier comments about the item is not mine anymore and all thier legalities but f*ck'em. If this happened at Canada Customs or US Customs there would be recourse available but because it happened at Erlanger Kentucky, Ebays global shipping centre I shouldn't get any answers. That just doesn't make sense to me. I will file the case later tonight when I get home and see what happens. Hopefully over the next few days I can make some progress regarding all this.

marnotom! · ‎05-12-2020

@bradgalley wrote:

This is when he told me that there is another department with greater jurisdiction within Ebay but I cannot be transferred there unless a case is open. He said just to open a simple "item not arrived" case and outlined the process of doing so. I have not opened the case yet because it involves the seller and I wanted his permission first before doing so. I messaged him last night and an hour ago recieved his blessing and full participation as he also wants answers. The rep told me that after I open the case with the information I have they will send an email to the seller and after he responds with collaborating information I can call Ebay and then be transferred to this "other" department.

Okay, I don't know the details the rep shared with you, but I can't see an "item not received"' claim working here. Maybe the rep was stringing you along, maybe the rep misunderstood the nature of your claim, maybe the rep doesn't understand how the GSP works. My thoughts are that since you've already received a refund, you have no grounds for a claim like this. "Item not received" claims are generally filed when you haven't received an item and you haven't received a refund or replacement. But maybe this rep knows something I don't?

@bradgalley wrote:

Now I admit, I may be going down a rabbit hole but I have questions I want answered, why was it marked restricted? Will it be resold and if so by who so I can have the original seller repurchase it? Will it be destroyed? I just want to know what has happened so this doesn't happen again. I understand the naysayers with thier comments about the item is not mine anymore and all thier legalities but f*ck'em. If this happened at Canada Customs or US Customs there would be recourse available but because it happened at Erlanger Kentucky, Ebays global shipping centre I shouldn't get any answers. That just doesn't make sense to me. I will file the case later tonight when I get home and see what happens. Hopefully over the next few days I can make some progress regarding all this.

This may sound harsh and obvious, but the razor was labelled restricted because somebody working at the Global Shipping Centre decided it was a restricted item. For whatever reason, somebody said "We can't forward this item to Canada." If Pitney Bowes decided that children's books were a restricted item and not forwardable, they're certainly within their rights to do that.

One of the GSP's many weaknesses is that it relies heavily on the seller providing accurate information on the nature of the item, and because some (if not many) sellers using the program are focussed strictly on domestic sales, they don't provide information in the listing that could be useful for a forwarded international item, such as its country of manufacture or its shipping size and weight. I'm of the same mind as those others posting who feel that somebody took the "mother of pearl" description literally (Why wouldn't they? Sellers are expected to describe their merchandise accurately.) and flagged the razor as a result. Remember, the GSP serves about 100 other countries besides Canada and the restriction guidelines are very broad and don't really make allowances for variation from country to country. If one of those 101 countries has an issue with vintage straight razors like the one you attempted to purchase, the others are going to have to conform to that one country's restriction.

One more point: I'm pretty sure that when the GSP was first unleashed on unsuspecting eBayers, "antiques" was a restricted category. There's a chance that there are a few zealous old-timers working in that Kentucky warehouse who haven't got the memo and are still flagging vintage or antique items as unforwardable.

Keep us posted on your claim!

15westcoast · ‎05-14-2020

Hi, I just wanted to add that I have bought several straight razors from Ebay

USA and they are not considered as weapon. Some people collect them and

others use them. They did make them with genuine mother of pearl handles ( I

have one--posted from USA direct from seller). The GSP held my knives because

the description mentioned "stag" handles. GSP's argument was that stag is a restricted

natural material and is prohibited. I kept after them that stag is collected as fallen antler

and is not restricted . They also do not like any mention of Ivory (yes, real ivory is prohibited)

but faux ivory, ivory like, ivorine , etc, are synthetic materials that resemble ivory and are not restricted, but they will hold them

if the "buzz" word ivory is in the description. I suspect mother of pearl would get the same

treatment and of course, it is not restricted at all. These people at GSP are not very knowledgeable.

marnotom! · ‎05-14-2020

@15westcoast wrote:

Hi, I just wanted to add that I have bought several straight razors from Ebay
USA and they are not considered as weapon. Some people collect them and
others use them. They did make them with genuine mother of pearl handles ( I
have one--posted from USA direct from seller). The GSP held my knives because
the description mentioned "stag" handles. GSP's argument was that stag is a restricted
natural material and is prohibited. I kept after them that stag is collected as fallen antler
and is not restricted . They also do not like any mention of Ivory (yes, real ivory is prohibited) but faux ivory, ivory like, ivorine , etc, are synthetic materials that resemble ivory and are not restricted, but they will hold them if the "buzz" word ivory is in the description. I suspect mother of pearl would get the same treatment and of course, it is not restricted at all. These people at GSP are not very knowledgeable.

I'm not very knowledgeable about blades, either. I just did some searching online and I found this 19 year-old message exchange from a knife discussion site and it didn't really do much to clarify things for me. I can see why there might be confusion about stag in knives if those drawing up guidelines for the floor workers at the Global Shipping Center are getting conflicting information such as what's in this exchange:

https://www.bladeforums.com/threads/stag-import-ban.160059/

fh991586 · ‎05-23-2020

If you want to know more about what happens to items that doesn't go through the GSP warehouse in Erlanger, this is a classic post on the subject:
https://community.ebay.com/t5/Archive-Shipping-Returns/Ebay-shipper-stole-my-gong-what-to-do/m-p/198...

dannyw1975 · ‎05-28-2020

If you want the phone number for the GSP warehouse in Kentucky, just send me a message. If I post it here, the GSP cheerleaders will have my post deleted.

dannyw1975 · ‎05-28-2020

You would also be advised not to listen to these people here. They are the same people who defend the GSP in every new discussion which occurs where unhappy buyers complain about it. They have vested interests, and will defend this fraud of a program at any opportunity possible. The GSP is engaging in mail fraud and theft of money from buyers. Do not listen to these people attempting to defend this program, or EBAY. You will see the same 5 or 6 people doing it all over the the community site. Just send me a message and I will give you the phone number for the GSP warehouse in Kentucky.