eBay

watch_lt · ‎01-01-2017

Hi Folks,

First and foremost happy New Year. This definitely isn't how I wanted my New Year to start..

I'll try and explain this in as much detail as I can. Basically, I sold a watch for $600 a month ago. It was shipped internationally from Canada. I marked the item, "as shipped" on eBay and messaged the buyer that the item is on the way but I was not able to get a tracking number as they didn't provide any tracking number at the post office. The buyer was very appreciative still and thanked me for the quick service.

Now, all of a sudden after owning the watch for several weeks, the buyer opened a case on PayPal saying they haven't heard anything from me about the watch and it hasn't arrived. Here is the thing: The buyer, (1 week after I shipped the watch) wrote in eBay messages that they received it and EVEN attached a picture of them wearing it.

I would greatly appreciate any opinions here as to what I can do. This has never happened to me and is really a shame that there are such people in this world that will burn money from other hard working folks over the internet.

I have proof of payment that I sent the parcel, (a physical receipt with the date/amount paid for the parcel).

I have proof of the eBay messages and conversation about them receiving the item already.

I honestly don't know what else to say, I am speechless right now. Appreciate any help, thank you.

i.am.vivian · ‎01-01-2017

@ikemaster55 wrote:
I sold a watch for $600 a month ago. It was shipped internationally from Canada. I marked the item, "as shipped" on eBay and messaged the buyer that the item is on the way but I was not able to get a tracking number as they didn't provide any tracking number at the post office. The buyer was very appreciative still and thanked me for the quick service.

Now, all of a sudden after owning the watch for several weeks, the buyer opened a case on PayPal saying they haven't heard anything from me about the watch and it hasn't arrived. Here is the thing: The buyer, (1 week after I shipped the watch) wrote in eBay messages that they received it and EVEN attached a picture of them wearing it.

I have proof of payment that I sent the parcel, (a physical receipt with the date/amount paid for the parcel).
I have proof of the eBay messages and conversation about them receiving the item already.
I honestly don't know what else to say, I am speechless right now. Appreciate any help, thank you.

I am speechless too. No, not really. What were you thinking sending an item without tracking? When you mail an item for any more than you are willing to lose, you only send with a tracked service. You can print off a label buying it online or if you are only using the post office, you say "I need to send this with Delivery Confirmation and, for $600, a signature". That costs more, but it doesn't look like you saved very much.

Marking an item as shipped means nothing at all. If it did, sellers would just mark things and never mail them. A physical receipt is not proof of anything, not unless it has the buyers name and address as well. That is only good as "proof of shipment" in case of a chargeback. Even the messages are not likely to be accepted as "proof" because eBay and PayPal want online DELIVERY CONFIRMATION.

I don't suppose you bought insurance. Thought you'd save on that too, did you?

Of course buyers lie. They steal. An untracked item means the buyer has the chance to get a $600 watch for free. The way it works is that if a seller can't prove delivery, the buyer gets a refund.

At this point all you can really do is call eBay, show them the messages and explain everything. You will probably lose and be out the $600 but you may as well try. If it were me, I would try calling PayPal if no luck with eBay.

silverpinups · ‎01-01-2017

I don't suppose you bought insurance. Thought you'd save on that too, did you?

You can't buy insurance if there is "no" Tracking Number. Tracked Packet has only 100.00 insurance. It would have to go Expedited or Xpresspost..

i.am.vivian · ‎01-01-2017

Wasn't sure. I've never shipped anything of that value without BOTH tracking and signature (the best "insurance" is signature imo) but if I were to take something just to the PO and mail it there, I'd have asked about SOMEthing. Some safety net for ME, if its not going tracked, then what about signed-for, or insurance. I couldn't just mail a $600 item anonymously and then wait around for 6 months with my fingers crossed, not if I wanted to get much sleep. At that point I'd have been told it's all risk or pay the higher cost. I don't like risk. I'd have bought whatever gave me peace of mind.

silverpinups · ‎01-01-2017

Yes, an expensive item needs to go with Insurance and a Tracking Number. Signature Confirmation is an option on Expedited and included with Xpresspost (I believe).

i.am.vivian · ‎01-01-2017

Yes, signature is an option for anything less than $750 (last I checked). I wouldn't want anyone to think I was saying it was mandatory. I personally add it to items valued at A LOT less than the 750, but to tell you the truth that is more because I am concerned about "safe drop" or whatever that is when letter carriers leave parcels on doorsteps. To my mind, the signature has double insurance value: It prevents items being left on the porch to be stolen that way, and it deters potential scammers because they, me, and the post office all know they signed for the item.

It has been so long since I used the Post Office to mail something the way the OP did. I was thinking what it would be like from the OPs perspective. Even when PP is down and I've had to run something in to mail, I know what service and how much before I get there. There must have been no mention of the items value because I can't imagine a clerk would not very earnestly suggest a tracked and insured service on a $600 item. It's always up to the person mailing, but cheap shipping only makes sense for cheap items. For ME, on a $600 item I'd have gone for the works.

I feel so sorry for the OP. Wish I could think of something else to try to stop that vile claim. If anything occurs to me, anything at all, I'll come back and add it.

silverpinups · ‎01-01-2017

Yes, the OP has my sympathies, but he/she will have to battle with PayPal over the claim and with a thread of hope he/she can use the message from the buyer (with photo attached) as evidence that the item was received.

esclyons · ‎01-01-2017

yes you need to call Paypal and speak to them directly, provide them with all the info you have, they can be very helpfull sometimes..but you really should of had a tracking number..

femmefan1946 · ‎01-01-2017

What shipping service did you use?

I have been under the impression that all international shipping through Canada Post was tracked., but on looking at the site

https://www.canadapost.ca/cpotools/apps/far/business/findARate?execution=e1s3

I notice that only Tracked Packet, ExpressPost and Priority are and they run $20+ more than the three cheaper services.

Look at your Post Office Receipt.

Is there any number on it that looks like a bar code? It would be near the top of the reciept.

That is you Proof of Mailing.

EBay doesn't accept that, but Paypal may.

By the way, did your buyer ask for a cheaper form of shipping? That is an almost certain sign that he plans to file and win a Dispute.

maximus7001 · ‎01-01-2017

The watch and the money are both gone now. How did you manage to fall for that one? The sunglasses and the kite will have the same fate.

watch_lt · ‎01-02-2017

Looks like I do have a number on the receipt. CP will be providing me tracking info.

Appreciate all the replies everyone.

pjcdn2005 · ‎01-02-2017

You can buy insurance through companies such as insurepost. They do require proof of shipping but you can get that with smal packet and by getting a receipt from the po when you mail it. That receipt has the scan code on it and I staple that to a copy of the original label to match it to the address.

i.am.vivian · ‎01-02-2017

ikemaster55 wrote:
Looks like I do have a number on the receipt. CP will be providing me tracking info.

If you have a number on the receipt you don't have to wait for CP to provide you with it, you can enter it here:

https://www.canadapost.ca/cpotools/apps/track/personal/findByTrackNumber?execution=e1s1

Try it. If it is any kind of tracking number at all, it will show up there. You did not say where it went. If it went to the US, try any and all numbers you might have here:

https://tools.usps.com/go/TrackConfirmAction_input

For $600 I'd be trying every number on the receipt.

femmefan1946 · ‎01-02-2017

CP will be providing me tracking info.

WOOT!

Anonymous · ‎01-02-2017

Are you kidding that you shipped a $600 item WITHOUT a tracking number??!! It is a stupid thing to do it. I ship all my items (even cheaper items) with tracking number across Canada, USA and around the world the last 2 years. From now on, consider starting to use tracking number to protect yourself!!

i.am.vivian · ‎01-02-2017

@Anonymous wrote:
Are you kidding that you shipped a $600 item WITHOUT a tracking number??!!

Based on what little information we were provided, it sounds as if the item was sent with a tracked service after all, only the OP did not know that the number on the receipt is the number to use online. The item was taken to the post office and mailed there. No PP label or anything. Canada Post can't conjure up tracking info on an item mailed without tracking. But since we were never actually told WHAT SERVICE was used, or for that matter what were the exact dates of everything, all any of us can do is guess.

My guess, the OP didn't know there was a tracking number on the receipt (odd that the clerk didn't mention it). That is also my hope. Nothing would make my week quite like hearing how a scammer got thwarted by a tracking number.

rose-dee · ‎01-03-2017

@ikemaster55 wrote:

Basically, I sold a watch for $600 a month ago. It was shipped internationally from Canada. I marked the item, "as shipped" on eBay and messaged the buyer that the item is on the way but I was not able to get a tracking number as they didn't provide any tracking number at the post office.

I feel sorry that you got a bit of a tongue-lashing from others for not having tracking, when the way I read your post was that you paid for a tracked service but the P.O. failed to provide you with a tracking number. That was their negligence, not yours.

I see from your subsequent note that Canada Post did finally provide you with the tracking number. That's good, and will hopefully help resolve the Paypal claim.

Did you purchase signature confirmation when you paid for the parcel at the P.O.? If so, the tracking# you were given should reflect that service if you check it online.

Although Paypal doesn't require signature confirmation for anything under $750 (I think that's the current amount), it's money well spent in my opinion for any item of significant value. Not only does it protect you from claims of non-receipt, but it can also prevent doorstep theft of a parcel that has actually been delivered, since the parcel must get into the hands of the recipient personally.

Insurance, on the other hand, only protects you against loss, theft or damage (i.e. not against non-delivery), so buying it depends on how risk-averse you are. You can purchase excess third party insurance if the Canada Post service you've chosen doesn't have sufficient coverage included.

I hope this turns out well for you in the end! Let us know.

i.am.vivian · ‎01-03-2017

@rose-dee wrote:
I feel sorry that you got a bit of a tongue-lashing from others for not having tracking,

No one here gave the OP any kind of a tongue-lashing at all. All I see are heartfelt comments and attempts to offer if not a solution then at least a bit of commiseration. If you see any kind of "lashing" it must be you who is putting it there. It is easy to come in at this late juncture and presume to know the best answer after having the benefit of so many other members' input, not to mention further information from the OP, something no one else here had.

No, all I see are kind people offering condolences, thoughts on how salvage a positive outcome, warm wishes for success, and even a bit of glee that the OP might not have lost out after all.

But that's me.

rose-dee · ‎01-08-2017

@i.am.vivian wrote:
"No, all I see are kind people offering condolences"

The reference was to certain remarks in posts 2, 10 & 15. It should really not be necessary to explain why these were unkind to the OP, even cruel. However, if I must explain, I don't consider using the word "stupid" a sympathetic response, for example, nor "how did you manage to fall for that one?", nor "what were you thinking", which all say essentially the same disparaging thing in different words.

Constructive criticism and firm opinions are good things, when done with courtesy and consideration, but we all deserve to be approached with personal respect from fellow sellers when we come to this board, even when we're dead wrong or have made obvious mistakes. To me that seems a pretty basic thing to ask.

i.am.vivian · ‎01-09-2017

@rose-dee wrote:
It should really not be necessary to explain why these were unkind to the OP, even cruel.

Oh my, I don't understand this. I thought everyone was kindly offering genuine and honest assistance. Your suggestion that others 'lack courtesy and consideration' and are 'not treating others with respect', seems itself palpably 'disparaging' when clearly each member demonstrates their altruistic sensitivity, in varying ways, certainly, but always artlessly unaffected and from the heart. Naturally if you choose to project your own perceptions on to the words and minds of others there seems little anyone can do to sway you in any other direction.

I don't think it's fair to say others here were being 'unkind' or 'cruel'. As it is only you who claims to see 'cruelty' in other members' good-natured and sincere responses, then yes, it is necessary for you to try to explain it. It is woefully hurtful to persist in so wrongfully accusing other members to the point of evident persecution, when even the frankest speaker is patently supportive of the OP and manifestly benignly compassionate toward the foibles of others. We've all been there so we empathize completely.

I suppose we'll have to agree to disagree on this, because I find I am always able to see the goodness and warmth that each member intended no matter how candidly they express their views. What I see from the wonderful members here is a lot of friendly, decent, helpful and kind-hearted generosity, earnestly focused on the issue at hand, plainly spoken or not.