Help. Buyer opened not received claim.

[phoenixhobbies]

Hi their, I would like some advice on how to deal with buyers that submit a not received claim.

Example, one I am currently dealing with. I am a seller in BC Canada and the buyer is in Thornbury England. The buyer has had the account since 2019 and has 678 ratings with 1 negative feedback.

The buyer bought a $12.00 CAD Pokémon Card that had $1.00 CAD Letter mail shipping.
The card was purchased on June 30th and I shipped July 1st.

The buyer submitted a not received claim before messaging me for help first, on July 17, 13 business days after the item was shipped.

I stated because it is international letter mail it may be delayed at customs or a sorting facility and may take some time to receive the item,

(Knowing from buying and have received letter mail 3 months later.) I had mentioned, If they do not receive it by August 2nd that I would refund the order, I felt was a fair amount of time for both of us.

The thing that is frustrating dealing with this is the fact the buyer did not message me first regarding this before opening a claim.

The other thing that is frustrating to deal with is that eBay holds all funds until the claim is closed. It would be better if they just held funds for the amount to that item.

Is their specific amount of days buyers and sellers have until a item is still not yet received and the seller can be protected even without no tracking on letter mail and amount of time for the buyer until they have to be refunded? Something of 60 or 90 days?

Thank you for your time and help, much appreciated.

[t_bjarnason]

"Is their specific amount of days buyers and sellers have until a item is still not yet received and the seller can be protected even without no tracking on letter mail and amount of time for the buyer until they have to be refunded? Something of 60 or 90 days?"

Unfortunately not - shipping without tracking is against eBay's recommended selling practices and you will never be covered unless you can prove the item has been delivered (tracked shipping). 

The buyer can open an INR claim as soon as the estimated delivery date passes - right up to 30 days after this date. Once they file an INR claim, you have 3 days to contact the seller and provide a resolution, which in most cases is a refund if the buyer doesn't respond or agree to wait, or you can't show that it's moving through the postal system with tracking. Issuing a full refund will automatically close the ticket and no negative feedback can be left by the buyer. Not dealing with the INR within 3 days will result in eBay stepping in and may have negative repercussions for you as a seller. 

You can find more information on eBay's INR policy here: https://www.ebay.ca/help/selling/managing-returns-refunds/helping-buyers-items-not-received?id=4116

Your only hope to get your money back would be if the package is eventually delivered and the buyer is honest enough to let you know they receive it and issues you back your money. Since you never know if it's actually been lost or stolen or if the buyer ever received it, you can never accuse them. 

[phoenixhobbies]

The buyer will not close the case until revived or the date we agreed on.

[t_bjarnason]

If they agree to wait until a certain date, consider yourself lucky! Most don't. It's great that your buyer is willing to work with you. 

As far as your frozen funds, you can reach out to eBat support via chat on their website and see if they can unfreeze them (at least the funds that are not related to this transaction). No garuntees but it's worth a shot!

[lotzofuniquegoodies]

@phoenixhobbies 

In doing a quick look at some(very random) of your listings for UK you are using US letter. You may want to change options and maybe add some handling time. (Best to be careful and not add too much. It can scare some buyers away). Economy Canada gives you 1 to 15 days for a window. US and Intl letter have shorter windows. You could use Economy Intl(at the bottom of the dropdown) for a longer lead time.

-Lotz

Sidenote: Delivery windows for letter mail seem very short to my eye. Even Intl US small pkt air/Intl small pkt air have short windows considering CP does not include with the calculator.

[femmefan1946]

You sold a card.

You were paid and shipped on July 1st.

• No you didn't.
• July 1st was Canada Day and the post office was closed.

You used LetterMail shipping.

LetterMail is not a tracked service.

The buyer has not yet received the card.

What date did eBay give as the last estimated date for delivery? She can't open a Dispute until that date has passed.

I stated because it is international letter mail it may be delayed at customs or a sorting facility

• No.
• International LetterMail is not supposed to carry products only documents. Yes, we all do it.
• But because theoretically there is no product, there is no duty, and there is no reason for the letter to pass through customs.

If you sold it for $12, I'm guessing you paid much less than that for it.

Your time is worth 25c a minute at BC minimum wage.

Refund.

You can't win an Not Received dispute without tracking and you have no tracking.

If you do not refund you will have a Defect on your selling account.

Defects lead to higher fees, restricted number and value for listings, or even closed selling account.

[ricarmic]

Hi, here is my experience in a similar situation.

It does not matter if the buyer agrees to wait or not. When you got the case message it will have provided a date you need to respond by, my guess is the 22nd. 

In my situation assuming the date in your note is the 22nd, at one minute after midnight on the 21st, ie the first minute of the 22nd I believe it will it automagically closed the case in favour of the buyer, irregardless of what they've said, and the status of the case, even if it says awaiting buyer response. My buyer did not do anything either, we had agreed on the actual date, I thought I had till midnight of the day in the email, it turns out it is at the beginning of the date, ie mine autoclosed at just after midnight of the 21st.

For possible future use, this is what I send to folks that have opened cases (note that the case date was the 18th): (this has to be sent as an ebay message, I send a short message via the case advising a more complete message is sent via ebay messaging)

Hi BUYERNAME! I am sorry to hear that the stamps have not yet arrived. I trust you got my note advising that they were shipped on Friday May 21st?

I definitely share your frustration with the postal delays! Unfortunately the COVID-19 pandemic is still affecting a lot of shipments with no rhyme nor reason as to which ones are affected. I have had a number of shipments to your area taking longer than normal in the last few weeks, I am not certain why. The good news is that ever since COVID began, my package loss rate has remained below 1/2 of 1% so over 99.5% of the time the packages do eventually arrive.

Now that a case has been opened the only options eBay gives me are to send a message or refund and irregardless of messages, I have to refund by Thursday June 17th. If it is ok by you, I will wait to refund until Thursday June 17. If it arrives before then, you can just close the case. If it does not arrive by the 17th, I will refund out of my own funds. There is a very very good chance it will arrive after that, and if it does please let me know and I’ll send another invoice so you can pay again (this is my full time job, small parcels like this are not insured so I am out 100% if they do not arrive).

Thank you very much for your patience during all of this, let me know if you are ok with this plan, and I hope you have a great day!!! RICARMIC (Ron)

================================================

Here's the squeaker message I put in the case:

Hi! eBay does not give me much room in these case messages, I’m sending a much more complete message separately via an eBay message, please let me know if you are ok with that plan.

[pjcdn2005]

As others mentioned, if there is no tracking, ebay will likely step in after 3 days and refund the buyer on your behalf whether or not the buyer has requested it.  Since you want to avoid getting an unresolved claim defect, you might want to refund the buyer before that time and politely ask them to let you know when they receive it so that you can invoice them.

I also urge you to change the overseas shipping in your listing from lettermail to economy international as that will give more time before a buyer can open a claim.  At least one of your listings currently shows the eta to the UK in 6-9 business days. That's unrealistic.

[ilikehockeyjerseys]

-Be polite with the customer. Tell them you will refund them by the case deadline if the card does not arrive. Instruct them to let you know if it does arrive by closing the case. 

-You shouldn't expect them to close the case if it hasn't arrived. They cannot re-open it if it never arrives.

-Refund them before the deadline. They will get an automatic refund regardless. It is not worth the defect.

-Message them to let them know you have refunded their payment. Politely instruct them to let you know when the item arrives so that you can arrange for them to either re-pay for the item, or so that you can provide a means of return shipping if they no longer want it. 

Otherwise, go through your listings and change the shipping method to generic economy ones that have more accurate shipping windows. Lettermail shipping windows aren't accurate on eBay. They are not reflective of how much variety there is with lettermail shipping time. Per eBay policy, buyers are entitled to open INR cases if an item does not arrive by the expected delivery date. No tracking means a buyer will win a case. It is also a good idea to write up a stock message to send to buyers letting them know their item has been handed off to Canada Post, while also setting expectations about possible ship times and covid mail delays. Once an INR is opened, you have to refund by the INR deadline. If a customer is confident their item is on the way and is not lost, they are a lot less likely to open an INR. 

Unless a buyer has a significant percentage of their feedback/feedback left for sellers showing they open INR cases, it is best to assume they are being honest, and to try to help resolve the issue. If someone is scamming you, there is nothing you can do about it other than reporting and blocking the buyer. The last thing you'd want to do treat someone poorly who is just wondering where their package is. Which in my experience is what most INRs are (most end up closed, or repaid, your results might be different depending on the category you sell in).

[phoenixhobbies]

I put it in the community mailbox on July 1st, does that not count as shipped? Yes, I’ve accepted the fact to cut my losses as a risk as a seller.

[phoenixhobbies]

The shipping tip is great, would not thought of that, thank you. Still trying to figure out the whole shipping thing. Seems like rocket surgery most times and I mostly just wing it. Seems to be a bit flawed, wish the calculated shipping actually worked.