Seller Beware

[shholl_56]

Sold my 1200 dollar computer for 400 dollars as it was a few years old and pre owned, I figured 33% of the value that's not bad. After the deal was done I ended up with 330 dollars because of shipping and taxes. This wasn't great but I thought whatever you know. Then once the buyer received the product they claimed a fradulant item not as described. Now I used a stock photo on a pre owned item. I'm new to this okay please cut me some slack. The phone app ASKED me if I wanted to use a recommended picture. I think if you're going to have a picture policy that you can't use stock photos on pre owned items then don't ask customers to use stock photos at all for pre owned items. Anyways the guy claimed a refund when I had a no return policy. I was told not to worry they're gonna get a return shipping label from him and then I can inspect the item to see if it's damaged whatever. So I'm told the case is on hold until March 28th, I wait for March 28th and then I'm told I lost the case, the buyer keeps the item and I lose all the money and now I owe ebay 120 dollars for shipping and taxes. I paid taxes and shipping to give someone my 1200 dollar computer for free because I used a stock photo. I'm currently in a fight with support because I was given wrong information with how to proceed. I'm supposed to move into a new apartment and get a new job and now they're gonna charge me 120 dollars and really mess up my life. I can't even take my bank account off of here and support has nothing to protect me against this kind of thing. This is a warning to anyone who decides to sell on here. Do yourself a favour and don't.

[reallynicestamps]

You did not pay shipping. The buyer paid shipping.

Even if you had used "free" shipping, the cost of shipping comes from the buyer's payment.

You did pay fees on shipping and on the sales tax the buyer also paid.

I'll let someone with better arithmetic skills explain it in more detail.

[rocketscollectibles]

As in another recent thread, this is why you do not sell expensive items to start. I won't go into everything but you did several mistakes.

First, ebay recommend picture before that you describe your item condition. It's your responsability to show and describe your item properly.

If you sold an item pre owned, i guess there was imperfections, signs of wear, or anything. If you did not show it, let me doubt that it was a fraudulent item not as described case.

No return does not means no refund, any seller could sell defective things and runaway.

When the buyer opened the item not as described case, you simply had to accept the return and provide a return label into the case. Have your item back, refund, and relist. You had 4-days to solve the case. You lost it for being a case closed without resolution.

You can't remove your bank account because, again, sellers could ripoff and runaway.

There is a logical system in place. I understand the situation is frustrating, i may be rude, but don't blame ebay for your mistakes. You blame ebay for not letting you sell a pre-owned item without photos and runaway with the money, it's not logic. Legit claim or not from the buyer, you have to solve an item not as described case by accepting the return. You had to click that you accept it, into the case. That's a statement. Sadly you lost your money because of your lack of knowledge, not ebay. An experienced seller do not lose his money in your situation. Again, do not sell expensive items online without knowledge. This is on you and you learnt it the hard way.

[flipistics]

@rocketscollectiblesI think he's complaining about 2 things specifically - one that eBay apparently recommended or at least encouraged him to use stock photos, and two that the horrible wording on how to handle returns is incredibly misleading. I would suggest he's right on both counts. That doesn't change the mistakes he made, but it is something eBay needs to fix. It creates a bad experience for the buyer and seller (eBay too if one or the other decide to never return).

Stock photos shouldn't even be an option, period. In fact, unless eBay has permission from the manufacturers to use them, using them probably breaks copyright law and could lead to lawsuits or VEROs.

The return process needs to be crystal clear to the seller. We see confusion here all the time with new sellers believing the case is being resolved for them and not realizing the steps they have to take.

[rocketscollectibles]

So if ebay recommend to jump over a bridge, it's ebay fault if you jump over a bridge? The fact ebay recommend an item match when you list has nothing to do with his situation. It's sellers responsability to list their items correctly. He agreed to use those photos. We're lacking infos but it seems like he sold a used item representing it as new. It's not ebay fault there.

I also have high doubts that the support told him to wait that the case close. I would not be surprised that there was misunderstanding. You say it's not clear but they have a full page about it and covering every return situation. He basically lost cause he forgot to answer to the case and accept the return.  

He tried to run before learning to walk and blame everyone except himself for falling. He messed on all the line and not a single word about he maybe did mistakes, everything is on his buyer and on ebay. Hard to have compassion here.

[recped]

---

@flipistics wrote:

@rocketscollectiblesI think he's complaining about 2 things specifically - one that eBay apparently recommended or at least encouraged him to use stock photos

---

eBay image policy

@rocketscollectibles that the horrible wording on how to handle returns is incredibly misleading.

Misleading in what way? There are only limited choices one of which is to accept the return and provide a label. Sounds like the OP never responded to the return request so the buyer escalated.

I cut the OP some slack up to the blame it all on eBay part, the process for returns is not complicated, in the OP's case there was no need to contact eBay about it.

[brettjet38]

As others have mentioned, the only thing I am taking away from your overly long and emotional post is that this whole incident is the fault of eBay, the Buyer, the APP, and the procedures and policies of the site you chose to sell your used item on.

I do not sense you accept any part of the blame or personal responsibility for your own actions in regard to this situation.

There are over 130 million ebay users, and contrary to urban legend most do read the basic selling rules beforehand and never have an issue.

Then we have the few that...

@shholl_56  "I'm new to this okay please cut me some slack."

That is not how it works, unfortunately. as a member you are responsible to read about listing items BEFORE you list them, especially high-risk USED items.

@shholl_56 "This is a warning to anyone who decides to sell on here. Do yourself a favour and don't."

Actually, it should say

"This is a warning to anyone who decides to sell on here. Do yourself a favor and take 10 mins to read the basic rules about selling on eBay, BEFORE YOU START SELLING. I did not and it cost me my own money"

https://www.ebay.ca/help/policies/selling-policies/selling-practices-policy?id=4346

Item description

The listing page is where buyers get most of their information about an item. Information in the listing helps buyers decide what to buy and know what to expect when they receive the item. It's important to make sure that the listing is only used to describe the item for sale and to communicate the terms of the sale in a professional way.

You're required to:

• Specify the condition of the item
• Describe any defects or flaws in the item – this helps avoid problems or buyer dissatisfaction

Note: When selling a used, refurbished, or flawed item, you must include photos of the actual item for sale instead of a stock photo.

[brettjet38]

https://www.ebay.ca/help/policies/selling-policies/selling-practices-policy?id=4346

15 mins article
Selling practices policy

Bottom of page

Other rules for sellers

You're responsible for reviewing and understanding our rules for sellers, as well as all relevant laws and regulations in your User Agreement.

Knowing our policies before you list an item can lead to smoother, more successful transactions, and it can help you avoid breaking rules by mistake.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

PDNR = People Do Not Read

It takes less than 15 mins to read the basic selling rules which cover ALL the steps to listing an item, including pictures and USED items, it is one sentence crisp and clear.

Unfortunately, the only thing that happened here is that when you do not read the rules...

[shholl_56]

Yeah not helpful at all, just rude and ignorant of my situation

[mrdutch1001]

The result of YOUR dilemma is not much "Seller Beware" as it is "SELLER BE AWARE!"

[brettjet38]

The issue here is Members just not reading, the picture policy is a 1 min article that clearly states the rules, a 1 min article...

All you have to do is type photos picture policy in the help section and you go right to the following...

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

1 min article

Picture policy

Photos are one of the most important parts of your listing because they allow potential buyers to see the item's exact condition, and help them decide whether to bid or buy. We recommend including more than one to help increase your chances of a successful sale.

What is the policy?

The following are not allowed:

• Photos that don't accurately represent the item
• Placeholder images used to convey messages
• Stock photos for used, damaged, or defective items
• Photos with added borders
• Photos with added text, artwork or marketing material
• Watermarks of any type, including those used for ownership attributions

Photos must be at least 500 pixels on the longest side. For more guidelines see our Adding pictures to your listings article.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Same thing for the return policy, very clear if you actually read it...

PDNR = People Do Not Read.

[brettjet38]

---

@shholl_56 wrote:

Yeah not helpful at all, just rude and ignorant of my situation

---

Are you serious, or just that entirely oblivious to your own part in your own mess?

Helpful? Rude? Ignorant?

Multiple people @mrdutch1001 @recped @rocketscollectibles @flipistics have pointed out the mistakes/oversites you made & offered replies and reasons as to why you are in this situation.

There is nothing anyone really can do, other than point out the Rules and Policies of the site you decided to sell your used "TAT" on in the first place, before "enlighting" yourself with those most basic selling rules.

What did you come here to post for, if not to get replies, what are you expecting?

An "echo" chamber that will "agree" with you and you're, well for lack of a better word "RANT".

You are incorrect.

This is an area to help members with issues and discuss topics relating to eBay and if a member "Rants" people will respond.

@shholl_56 "Yeah not helpful at all, just rude and ignorant of my situation"

And again, your situation is of your own making for not taking the time to read a few basic rules about selling an item before you actually listed and sold the item...

...and that mate, is ALL ON YOU, no one else.

But, we can at least post responses that will help other members who stumble upon this "Seller Beware" post in the future when it becomes just another ZOMBIE THREAD that got resurrected.

[ricarmic]

As someone selling online for over 20 years, it is very hard to picture what it is like for a very irregular or new seller in the current online world, it is a LOT more difficult now than it was when I started.

From what I see in the sell your stuff here advertising for eBay it makes it sound like it is quick and easy takes only a couple minutes to sell your pair of collector sneakers.

For us established users, we've already learned, often the hard way all the little/big quirks, wordings, risks etc, mostly by first hand experience or by frequenting boards like this.

Expecting a new seller to know where to look and what to read especially balanced against what I think the advertising presents might not be realistic when there are a lot of things one has to know, especially in some of the higher risk categories.

I know myself when I get the "policy updates" for here, or PAYPAL or my credit card or whatever, I at best look at the high level, I don't remember when I've read the whole 477 page (for dramatic purposes) document.

My analogy is the construction documentation for a new printer for example. There's the full instruction "book" and the "quick setup" page for impetuous people like me.

I don't know if eBay has anywhere a "quick setup" style document for new sellers but I think that might help a lot, even in the worst case it could point folks to places/links to look for certain situations.

devon@ebay what does a new seller get presented with when they sign up? I can't imagine they just get sent to the help area, is there something like a "quick setup" list for a new seller?

[recped]

As someone selling online for over 20 years, it is very hard to picture what it is like for a very irregular or new seller in the current online world, it is a LOT more difficult now than it was when I started.

Definitely selling on eBay has become much more complicated than it was 20+ years ago, So has selling anywhere or for that matter doing anything involving technology (just about everything these days).

From what I see in the sell your stuff here advertising for eBay it makes it sound like it is quick and easy takes only a couple minutes to sell your pair of collector sneakers.

I don't actually see that much adverting for sellers from eBay, I definitely see a lot for Etsy and Poshmark, they tell you that you can list your item in less thana minute, it will always sell right away and the money will just come floating in like magic.

I don't know if eBay has anywhere a "quick setup" style document for new sellers but I think that might help a lot, even in the worst case it could point folks to places/links to look for certain situations.

On the home page, at the bottom which is where most sites display this type of info.

Leads to this

[triplecgirl]

I agree with sellers not understanding how to proceed with a damage claim. I have been a seller for 20 years, a very concientious one. I almost missed the cut off date to do a return as I was waiting for pictures of damage that never came. I was dumb enough to think the next step was an insurance claim for damage.  I had no idea that  I just had a few days or the case would be closed.  In 20 years I have never had anything come back, so I am a newbie at getting stuff back too I guess.
I also post here to caution all new sellers to stay off eBay as  it is becoming too easy to scam a seller.  I sold a new item, fully tested, plastic and metal. Shipped it like the china I used to sell, double boxed it, so damage is  impossible.  Picture of fully intact box at  delivery through Fedex.
I still fully expect to  lose my case eventhough  I know I have done things perfectly, but I refuse to let the buyer keep nice merchandise for nothing.
Although I understand Ebay is protecting the buyer, they are also setting up a perfect scam scenario. Beware!

[mrdutch1001]

eBay provides the dates by which the processes must be completed by, so it is still the seller's responsibility to know and follow the processes...and it matters not whether a seller is a 20 yr vetern on eBay or a new seller; it is still SELLERS BE AWARE!

[rocketscollectibles]

I don't understand why there's debate about the complexity for new sellers. When we receive a case, it's black on white that you must provide a solution, and before the date they say. The options are there, and the date you must select an option is there.

Please take action by ''date''

Select a reply:

''your options''

It's also probably written that if you do not provide a solution the case may be closed in buyer's favor.

There's also full page describing EVERY single return situation. You can find this page in 30 seconds with a google search, or even on ebay. There's plenty of ressources, such as the community boards, ebay support, or even forums such as reddit.

It can't be more simple.

The author of the thread basically lost cause he did not click on 'accept return' and did let the 4-days go. I mean, how can you blame anyone else than the seller. He says support told him to wait until the end of the case, there's clear confusion between seller and support. The support would not tell someone to handle a return by letting the case close without resolution... He most likely told them he accepted the return (which he did not), so they told him to wait.

He found the community boards to rant but not to ask how to handle a return. He used stock photos to sell pre-owned item. He thought no return policy means no refund and no return. He clearly did not read any rules. He went into confusion with support. He blame buyer for making a fraudulent claim while he obvioulsy fasly represented his item. He also do not take responsability for anything that happened. This thread is not about complexity of ebay for new sellers... It's about doing mistakes and bad seller's pratices.

[brettjet38]

@triplecgirl "I have been a seller for 20 years, a very concientious one."

That is basically irrelevant, as a Seller you are supposed to keep up to date by reading selling policies as required...

 4 min article

How to handle a return request as a seller

https://www.ebay.ca/help/selling/managing-returns-refunds/handle-return-request-seller?id=4115&st=3&...

Returns are not complcated nor are the instructions on how to handle them, but actually reading them seems to be an issue for certain folk.

If a Seller chooses not to follow the rules and policy which is laid out in black and white, in short, clear explanations, then it falls on that member, not eBay, the Buyer, the APP, the Rules, and why are they always screaming?

And as @rocketscollectibles said

"This thread is not about the complexity of eBay for new sellers...

............................................................................................It's about doing mistakes and bad seller's practices."

[triplecgirl]

Nope.  Wrong. It is just too easy to scam ebay sellers by buying an item, saying it is damaged,getting a refund and my shipping paid.  I  am banking on the seller thinking it not worth  sending return postage, and that the seller will have let the case time out.  I can then sell the item on Marketplace or  somewhere. How perfect. How many emails and drop addresses can I have? How many things can I get on each address before Ebay kicks me off? I personally actually would llike to know that . 
I have as a seller protection from that through eBay for that? Remains to be seen. I can block new buyers but that is hurting all parties involved. Had to do it though.
The original poster selling his computer was a newbie.  Perhaps Ebay can send big red notices  that the dispute window is timing out, and  the buyer will then get the item for free. 
He made some mistakes and paid the price, but the buyer gets a free computer??
Now this seller will tell  anyone who will listen how he got taken, and the buyer is having a good laugh and telling his friends how to get something for free. Bad situation all around.

[triplecgirl]

How much feedback did the buyer have?