ebay rejects refund dispute appeal -buyer came back to say got the item after all & wants to pay

[Anonymous]

Is this for real? ebay denied my appeal over refunding a buyer despite her coming back and saying she did get the item after all.  She wants to pay for it for pete's sake! They refunded her same day she got it, yesterday.  She's being honest and wants to pay for it, is ebay encouraging dishonesty or what I just can't believe this!

I am not a business seller, just a seller of my own things I no longer want.  Both the buyer and myself are unsure of what to do about this situation...she purchased and the item was mailed Canada Post lettermail right around Easter, of course it was delayed in arriving by over a week, but she finally got it yesterday.  I want to add that in my experience there are always mail delays when long weekends are involved. Unfortunately instead of contacting me by message she opened a dispute with ebay over it - she is new to ebay.  In my notification from ebay it said they would refund her on the 20th if I did not.  I did not, and kept communication open with the buyer through the dispute ticket because I knew the item would get there, although late and the buyer was willing to wait.

As I stated, she did get the pkg yesterday and came back to find the dispute closed & refund issued so she sent me a message saying she got it and couldn't find a way to notify ebay, no link she found pertained to this situation.  I went back and looked through my ebay messages and found the appeal button so I used it and wrote them of the situation.  I then let her know I did that, which is when she said she tried to do the same but couldn't find a way.

I am absolutely floored that ebay turned their back on this situation and I'd like to know if this has happened to anyone else. Constantly reading in this community about dishonest buyers and sellers and in the case of an honest one they turn the other cheek.  Incredible.

[ricarmic]

An alternative way to fix this is to just create a special ebay lot for the buyer to purchase and pay for again. This works under either pre/post MP situations.

If you are pre MP you can reply to the PAYPAL payment to get the buyers address so you can send another paypal invoice for the original amount.

Note though that if eBay automagically closed the case, you probably have a defect, a call in might get that fixed or it might not....

[Anonymous]

Unfortunately I am already on managed pmts so paypal is out of the question, I did mention that to her as an option too. I don't think she has paypal anyway she sounds new to digital commerce.

I realize I likely have a defect on my perfect record because they did auto close it.  According to the timing of the notifications it would appear they did that and issued the refund shortly after midnight of the 19th, technically making it the 20th and the date they promised to do so.  I expected they'd wait until the end of the day on the 20th and intended to refund her myself if she still did not get it that day with 3 PM her time as my own deadline but I did not get the opportunity.  Lesson learned.

I am just alarmed that ebay chooses to operate in this manner with no consideration for this kind of situation. I'm not being ripped off by a buyer, I'm being ripped off by ebay.

Thanks for adding your advice, much appreciated.

[ricarmic]

The unfortunate part is we all tend to think of ebay like us a "person" handling things. Unfortunately nobody is looking at these cases and applying any judgement, it is simply automated processes handling all of them (which is reasonable, otherwise ebay would need many 100s more employees to handle all this).

The important part for us is to make sure we know what the automagic rules do/n't do to protect ourselves. 

Often once the automagic process has handled it the CSRs arms are mostly tied (I once had 3 different CSRs "fix" something that the system kept reapplyling automagically to "unfix" it!)

Aside from whether or not you follow up on the defect I really suggest just creating a new ebay item just for the buyer, they buy it, you mark it as shipped an everyone (including ebay) is happy. I live in a more honest (stamp) world and often have buyers repaying afterward. I create "special lot for PARTIALbuyername" lots all the time.....however I'm not yet afflicted with MP......

[pjcdn2005]

Something similar happened to me earlier in the year. If there no tracking or tracking hasn't been updated recently, they will automatically refund whether or not a buyer asks them to step in. That's been in effect since last year and its annoying as heck because many buyers are willing to wait an extra few days.

Anyway...if you have facebook or twitter, send a private message with the case details, tell them what happened and ask them to remove the defect.  They did in my case although I did have tracking showing delivery on Canada Post..it just hadn't carried over to ebay. They may or may not remove the defect and/or give you a courtesy refund.

https://www.facebook.com/eBayForBusiness

https://twitter.com/askebay

Once the buyer has been refunded, ebay cannot reach into their account and take the money back.  Generally the only time an appeal will work in that situation is if there is delivery confirmation showing that the buyer received the item before the case was closed and then ebay may give you a courtesy refund but it can't hurt ask again to see if they will help you even though you don't have tracking.

[recped]

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@ricarmic wrote:

An alternative way to fix this is to just create a special ebay lot for the buyer to purchase and pay for again. This works under either pre/post MP situations.

If you are pre MP you can reply to the PAYPAL payment to get the buyers address so you can send another paypal invoice for the original amount.

Note though that if eBay automagically closed the case, you probably have a defect, a call in might get that fixed or it might not....

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Just did one a couple of days ago with a very nice guy from Chile who waited patiently for 2 months and  finally received their item at the 84 day mark.

Special listing for him to repay,  eBay got their fees which had been refunded to me when i refunded the buyer. I did lose out on the 30 cent fixed free from the original transaction (and by choice I discounted the payment amount a bit given the buyers honesty).

As far as eBay refunding, eBay simply looks to see if tracking shows delivery or not, it's irrelevant that tracking might show delivery a day later or a week later the fact is that when they refunded the buyer delivery had NOT happened. The only type of appeal that could work for you is if you can prove that at the time of refund the tracking did in fact show as delivered. If you could do that eBay would refund you out of their pocket because once a buyer is refunded there is no way for eBay to pull back the funds.

[doc-holmes · Accepted solution]

Since the transaction is complete the two of you can now trade contact info. If you give the buyer your email they can send you the money through PayPal, or even an e-transfer. Heck, they could send you a cheque, it doesn't matter. As far as ebay is concerned, this transaction is done, so how they send you the money us up to you two.

[Anonymous]

Yes!  I didn't even think of etransfer.  I was very concerned I could be blacklisted by discussing outside pmt with her in ebay messages, but your reply makes perfect sense since ebay loses nothing and neither does she.  Thank you for the solution!

[Anonymous]

I don't do twitter and although I have a FB acct I haven't been there in a few years but I'll give your solution for the defect a whirl, thanks.

[Anonymous]

I was considering this as a solution until I saw the etransfer solution.  I prefer that as ebay already got their fees out of me and doing this would give them more fees.  I will not forget this as a solution should it happen again though thanks very much!

[ricarmic]

Hi! Just as a note, when the money was refunded you got your ebay fees back, except the 30c or whatever the transaction amount is.

The problem with an etransfer might be reluctance from the buyer to do it, I'd be interested to know if they're ok with that, please let us know what happens!

[Anonymous]

She suggested it herself in a message today too so all is good, it was waiting in my messages.  She sounded a little shy of Paypal, said etransfer was simple.

I thought ebay kept the fees if they refunded rather than me doing it myself?  They refunded it, I didn't get the chance as I had expected it would be the end of the day, not the start when they did it.

Indeed there was a defect on me too so I wrote them on FB.  There was also 2 other notes that buyers reported late shipping this month that I wasn't even aware of.  When I look at my feedback records it shows perfect on all counts, I didn't know this defect and shipping report stuff even existed!  I really think it completely unfair sellers are getting defects for late shipments, we've got no control once we drop them off and there are delays across all carriers not just Canada Post although CP seems the worst now.

[1316033]

I read your unfortunate experience with interest.  The same thing happened to me yesterday, whereby eBay issued the refund to the buyer and closed the case, eventhough the buyer was willing to wait a couple of extra days for the item.  The main difference here is that your buyer did receive the item whereas mine did not and may never receive it.  

All of us can agree that if a buyer does not receive an item, they should be issued a full refund with an apology and no questions asked. What I found offensive in my case is the reality that the issuance of a refund is: 1) automatic, regardless as to your communication and agreement with the buyer, 2) the no tracking # and lack of signature confirmation being the only reasons given, and 3) the realization, as another member pointed out, that we are dealing with a computer software that lacks common sense, is not able to apply logic, and is not able to think outside the box.  Perhaps #3 is the most frustrating because the "software" program doesn't care and is not offended if you refer to it as an idiot or a moron...Lol!!

As for the "defect" it's just adding insult to injury.  Until now I did not even know such a thing existed. I suspect the overwhelming majority of eBayers don't either and could care less.  

[lotzofuniquegoodies]

@ricarmic 

Re: Afflicted. Interesting way of putting it?

Will you be getting a shot for that once it's available? 😁

-Lotz

[femmefan1946]

The Seller Hub occasionally has shown me that a Defect on my account has been removed.

But I have never been told I had a Defect to begin with.

This may be part of having Top Rated Seller status?  I dunno.

[lotzofuniquegoodies]

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@1316033 wrote:

I read your unfortunate experience with interest.  The same thing happened to me yesterday, whereby eBay issued the refund to the buyer and closed the case, eventhough the buyer was willing to wait a couple of extra days for the item.  The main difference here is that your buyer did receive the item whereas mine did not and may never receive it.  

All of us can agree that if a buyer does not receive an item, they should be issued a full refund with an apology and no questions asked. What I found offensive in my case is the reality that the issuance of a refund is: 1) automatic, regardless as to your communication and agreement with the buyer, 2) the no tracking # and lack of signature confirmation being the only reasons given, and 3) the realization, as another member pointed out, that we are dealing with a computer software that lacks common sense, is not able to apply logic, and is not able to think outside the box.  Perhaps #3 is the most frustrating because the "software" program doesn't care and is not offended if you refer to it as an idiot or a moron...Lol!!

As for the "defect" it's just adding insult to injury.  Until now I did not even know such a thing existed. I suspect the overwhelming majority of eBayers don't either and could care less.  

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@1316033 

To carry on your point regarding just closing INR's almost automatically there have been reciprical annoucements on dot com and dot ca (also International sites) with assorted verbiage during Covid. The dot com / dot ca announcements addressed USA to Can and Can to USA and allowing an extension.  The International announcement addressed the majority of situations. There have been neverending problems at various sort plants. Quarantining, system backlogs, routing variations etc. As to whether any late shipment situations are still being fully monitored is up in the air. I believe the last Seller Protection Summary I received was March. Reviewing it only tells me defects were removed but there seems to be no easy way to figure out what the defects were or where to? Helpful information to know where problems may be happening.

-Lotz

https://community.ebay.ca/t5/Announcements/Significant-delays-to-Canada-Post-deliveries-to-the-Unite...

[lotzofuniquegoodies]

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@1316033 wrote:

I read your unfortunate experience with interest.  The same thing happened to me yesterday, whereby eBay issued the refund to the buyer and closed the case, eventhough the buyer was willing to wait a couple of extra days for the item.  The main difference here is that your buyer did receive the item whereas mine did not and may never receive it.  

All of us can agree that if a buyer does not receive an item, they should be issued a full refund with an apology and no questions asked. What I found offensive in my case is the reality that the issuance of a refund is: 1) automatic, regardless as to your communication and agreement with the buyer, 2) the no tracking # and lack of signature confirmation being the only reasons given, and 3) the realization, as another member pointed out, that we are dealing with a computer software that lacks common sense, is not able to apply logic, and is not able to think outside the box.  Perhaps #3 is the most frustrating because the "software" program doesn't care and is not offended if you refer to it as an idiot or a moron...Lol!!

As for the "defect" it's just adding insult to injury.  Until now I did not even know such a thing existed. I suspect the overwhelming majority of eBayers don't either and could care less.  

---

@1316033 

To carry on your point regarding just closing INR's almost automatically there have been reciprical annoucements on dot com and dot ca (also International sites) with assorted verbiage during Covid. The dot com / dot ca announcements addressed USA to Can and Can to USA and allowing an extension.  The International announcement addressed the majority of situations. There have been neverending problems at various sort plants. Quarantining, system backlogs, routing variations etc. As to whether any late shipment situations are still being fully monitored is up in the air. I believe the last Seller Protection Summary I received was March. Reviewing it only tells me defects were removed but there seems to be no easy way to figure out what the defects were or where to? Helpful information to know where problems may be happening.

-Lotz

https://community.ebay.ca/t5/Announcements/Significant-delays-to-Canada-Post-deliveries-to-the-Unite...