Purchased label & insurance through eBay for Canada Post, item got lost and now no insurance payout

[envyemporium]

I sold and shipped an item worth over $1000 and purchased the shipping label with insurance for full coverage (total cost for the label was around $50 CAD for expedited + insurance) for Canada Post through eBay. The item got lost, and this was confirmed by Canada Post, so I refunded the buyer.

However, when I tried to make a claim with Canada Post they told me no insurance was purchased. This is strange because I had selected the insurance when buying the shipping label through eBay and I received an email confirming that I had, as it had the cost breakdown of the label purchase and insurance was listed there. This is the label I printed out and sent with the package.  After speaking to an eBay representative, they informed me that in my eBay invoice, the shipping cost was only around $22! which didnt make sense as the email which contained the shipping label said it was $50. Additionally, under 'My shipping label' section in the seller account, it also shows $50 for the the total cost of the label. 

I sent Canada Post's claim department all the screenshots and evidence I had which included the cost of the item, how much it sold, the shipping label and cost breakdown I received from eBay in my email. They informed me they could not do anything as in their system no insurance was purchased and that the issue was on eBays end as in their system this error is not possible. They also told me that for the tracking number on the shipping label my name was not even on it and that the sender was shown as 'eBay' which is highly irregular as they have not seen that before and that with all the cases they have dealt with through amazon,ebay, etc the sender name was the name of the client. This is an issue because even if Canada Post was to offer the insurance claim payout it would go to eBay and not me

I then tried to speak with eBay and explain to them what the Canada Post claims agent told me and was not given any help at all. I even had the number of the claims agent and had him willing to speak with eBay to confirm on their end what the situation was and an agent promised he would contact the Canada Post agent but he never did. I spoke with at least 4 different eBay customer service reps who all promised they would escalate this case and have it resolved or that a supervisor would call me back but I received no help or reply.

I've spent at least 8+ hours on the phone over the past 2+ months trying to resolve this issue, and for the most part Canada Post has been responsive and have actually escalated the case but eBay has done nothing to help and have outright lied to me on several occasions.

I attached a portion of the email I got from eBay which had the shipping label and cost

Is there anything I can do at this point?

[intimewithmusic]

Re: Shipping high value IE: $1000 items internationally and domestically.

"inconvenience them by cancelling, refunding then asking them to repurchase"

None of that is necessary.  If you make an error on the form and print a label that doesn't include the coverage or features you need void the label. Do not cancel the order.

Contact the customer via Ebay messaging.  Get their agreement for them to fix it or to let you fix  it at your end.  You have brought it to their attention. Ebay can see your messaging. Print a proper label.  Keep in mind if you fix it at your end the error will still be left on their profile to torment future sellers. 

There's no need to cancel the order unless you waited too long to act and your shipping window ran out or, the buyer is non responsive. In the case of a non responsive buyer of a $1000 iten you have big a red flag. Call Ebay for direction. 

[intimewithmusic]

The key word you used is "was". That was back in the dark ages. We're not talking about a space. It's a 7th character in the space that should not happen. CP will correct it by automatically deleting the data and inserting theirs unless you set it to manual. Postal codes can change for one reason or another so that is a good thing. On the other hand Shippo will reject 7 characters.  I don't know about PayPal these days. 

[intimewithmusic]

Hi taslim604.

This is all very good advice from  Mrspecialeditions. 

With regards to your question about small claims court. 

When I owned a brick and mortar music centre I have gone that route for a guitar + amp package. The value was $1200. To my surprise the culprit actually appeared at the hearing.  He lived in the same city. Most of the time they don't appear and the court issues a warrant. You have to wait until they catch up with them and start over with another hearing. 

In my case the judge ordered the guy to pay me $20 per month until the items were paid for.  This would take 5 years. The 1st payment had to be paid immediately. I recd $20 in front of the judge. That was the last time I ever heard from the guy. 

I can understand why others absorb the loss. 

ITWM

[richardcm]

All the others shippers simply did the same thing. Modifying existing code designed for USA to work. Not following CP specification. Respectfully, your are incorrect in your position on this. Everyone being wrong does not make it right. 

[intimewithmusic]

Re: Selling high value Items $1000 plus

Hi. I'm sorry there is no quote attached and I can't figure out which message/discussion you're addressing.

For myself this subject is important because  I sell high value often. I have stuff to list in the next 30 days but due to the number of disputes this year I'm holding back.

This is not not a challenge or contest to figure out who is right.  I'm only interested in customer service and Seller Protection for high value items. Given what is going on right now with today's new obstacles such as  porch pirates and Buyer credit card chargebacks and labels it's important to swap best practises particularly if they're  current  & coming from recent experience. We can all keep up to date and worry less when we ship these items. 

My track record is not bad . I've been selling internationally since 1981 and so far never had to file a claim. Knock on wood. This is why I take the time here to say how that was possible and to learn. You have to talk about what works for you.  I respect all veterans. I listen to what works for them.  However I also look to see where their experience is coming from to be sure it's relevant to where I'm headed. 

Here are some interesting facts some of the newer sellers should know. (from 2019-2020)

90% of everything sold on Ebay.com are items that sell under $30USD.  

50%  "          "                                                                                            under $12USD.

4%     "          "                                                                                            $30-$100USD.

6%     "           "                                                                                            $100USD plus.

If this discussion has been about items that sell from Canada that are over $1000 there really isn't a whole lot of experience to draw from.  This thread is important because it is about best practises with respect to insurance, customer service, scammers and shipping addresses as they apply to sending a $1000 or greater item only. No one expects this type of attention be given to a $20 thrift widget. 

That is why I want to know what MrSE and the other HD sellers who are weathering the current scam storm have to say. Although he restricts his sales to Canada and the USA he's out there in the trenches.  He also lost an HD shipment and gave the newer seller above some pretty good advice in his strategy on how to deal with it. 

The advise I've left on selling a $1000 item is to help newer sellers avoid an insurance claim in the first place. Take it for what it is.  I have zero experience fighting a claim for insurance. I am here learning from other in an effort to keep it that way.  

ITWM

[byto253]

That is one thing about "winning" in court, you still need to collect and that is not easy unless there is an ability to garnishee or something.  For an individual such in your situation, having a judgment against them is a killer for credit and borrowing.  If they don't pay, I would contact and send the document to the credit agencies.   

In this case with a large public company like Ebay, it is different.  If they lose it is highly unlikely that they would not pay.  The cost for them to send out a lawyer for $1k or so is not likely worth it for them and they are likely to pay when the suite is lodged.  You are demonstrating to them that you do care and will take the steps to protect themselves.

In the highly unlikely event that they would not pay after getting a judgement against them, there is the PR angle and press potential.  Great story about the little guy getting scr*wed by the big guy.   

[intimewithmusic]

Hi.

   You're right. I doubt for such a small amount, you'd want to try to pull that off on Ebay. In the retail music store businesses we had our share of criminal and civil litigation. I could never have afforded a lawyer to do that even locally. I had experience in litigation so that one was easy with one exception...

  These are bad guys. If you take them to criminal court the judge asks you to stand in the courtroom and physically point your finger at them and say " Yes, that's the guy." On one occasion a famous business owner's house was broken into.  I caught the guy trying to buy a drumset with the stolen credit card. I had to stand in court in front of his entire gang and point him out. Civil litigation is "softer" but you never know. 

[pjcdn2005]

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@intimewithmusic wrote:

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@pjcdn2005 wrote:

Removing a hyphen does not affect seller protection. That is simply correcting the format, it's not changing an address.  

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Hi. 

There is more going on here than a "hyphen". Poor Seller customer service, not poor Ebay customer service, and the fact Ebay is putting Sellers at risk by not verifying shipping addresses.

This isn't just a problem for the Seller. It's a problem for the Buyer and the next Seller.   Fine, just look after yourself. Don't bother to contact them. Leave their shipping address incorrect in the system waiting to jeopardize their next purchase.

You may cause "Lotz", "Mrspecialeditions" or possibly and unfortunately "reallynicestamps" to have the same time wasting problem. Now they have to waste their time troubleshooting another failed label. You got what you want so it's OK..unless you made a mistake editing Ebay's data and lost your SP but it's just a hy-phen. To me that sounds like poor customer service for your buyer and a grave disservice to the next Seller. 

   At the same time we're hearing complaints about Ebay's poor customer service when in fact most Ebay CSRs are knowledgeable, polite and helpful to get your problem fixed. It is not their fault Ebay is not verifying these addresses. Most companies immediately verify email address by sending a follow up email.  Ebay is not verifying shipping addresses.  Who is the 1st to find out a buyer has a wacky addy?  You.

If the buyer made a mistake entering their postal, area code or zip code it's possible something else is wrong with the address.  This tends to happen more with overseas buyers so if you ship solely domestic or to the USA you won't run into as many wacky addys.  When I contacted my Australian customer he realized he duplicated the mistake on numerous selling platforms.  He was grateful and made a $280 purchase one week later. 

Fine, just look after yourself. Don't bother to contact them. Leave their shipping address incorrect in the system waiting to jeopardize their next purchase.  Poor service leaves money on the table. 

IT

PS. It's frightening one of the largest high tech internet platforms on the planet includes a Canadian postal code entry field that accepts 7 characters. 

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Excuse me?   How do you equate removing a hyphen so that an address works as only looking after myself?  I guess correcting the address to be able to ship the package ASAP isnt looking after the customer?    You made the comment that removing the hyphen would jeopardize seller protection. I simply stated that it wouldn't jeopardize it.   There was no reason for you to suggest that your customer service was superior to mine because of one comment.

I agree with the other poster that this topic has nothing to do with the op's problem but I will mention one more thing as a caution to other readers.  If the buyer's address needs to be changed ebay used to say that if the buyer gave you the new addresses in messages, the seller would still qualify for seller protection for an inr.  But it's my understanding that they will no longer consider an address change given in a message as a payment address when an inr is filed on eBay or with the buyer's  payment provider.  If a seller is worried about seller protection, it is always best to cancel and refund.  That has been stated by the board reps a few times.   

[taffy1230]

Sure wish I had found this discussion before shipping a parcel that arrived with contents missing.

Same as others I have many hours on phone and chat with eBay support, 

Today I supposedly reached a supervisor at eBay and they assured me that Canada Post covers insurance.  Canada Post does not agree as so many have discovered.   The promptly paid the base $100 included in the base postage

Reporting to the fraud folks seems a good idea.

Very glad my buyer is patient and it was only a few hundred dollars loss

[envyemporium]

I get what you are saying here, but when I received an email with the shipping label it showed I bought insurance. So I saw this in my email and I printed

the shipping label and sent the package.

[envyemporium]

Just want to update here is the process for buying the shipping label. I selected the service and then added the insurance. 

I then received an email showing this. It linked an option to print the label which I selected and printed to stick on the package and ship. 

[mr.special-editions]

@taffy1230  

Sorry to hear about your situation, I'm glad to hear your buyer cooperated as that is a requirement to claim most forms of insurance.

I'm assuming you used eBay labels and if you selected extra insurance, you can see that on the eBay labels receipt emailed to you. You received the $100 and base postage because eBay labels for some reason is not capturing extra/additional insurance when sellers select it.

eBay labels Canada Post service for sellers is through the Solutions for Small Business (Canada Post offers this it's not an eBay program) this is a free service anyone can sign up for through CP.  Below is the link if you want to create your own personal account, you won't get the level 3 discount (only temporary from eBay at the moment) however as you spend money on shipping you can reach level 2, 3 and 4. There's also multiple shipping options that are exclusive to using Canada Post directly, some of them are helpful for more expensive items.

https://www.canadapost-postescanada.ca/cpc/en/business/small-business.page 

One possible reason that eBay labels is not capturing the extra insurance is because with a Solutions for Small Business account if you want to purchase insurance that amounts to $200 and over, Canada Post forces a signature (it checks off the signature box, greys it out, you cannot remove it, I posted photos showing examples) Regardless there's a big problem with eBay labels and Canada Post and currently eBay sellers that did nothing wrong are and will be paying the price for it.

[intimewithmusic]

Hi taslim604

When you ship your items out do you allow the label vendor to use your Ebay listing title as the description of contents on the label?

I'm assuming this was the listing title of the missing item. 

EVGA GeForce RTX 3060 XC BNIB & SEALED

Thanks

ITWM

[mr.special-editions]

@envyemporium if you make any headway keep us posted

[intimewithmusic]

Thank you for adding to this topic!

[pjcdn2005]

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@mr.special-editions wrote:

@taffy1230  

Sorry to hear about your situation, I'm glad to hear your buyer cooperated as that is a requirement to claim most forms of insurance.

I'm assuming you used eBay labels and if you selected extra insurance, you can see that on the eBay labels receipt emailed to you. You received the $100 and base postage because eBay labels for some reason is not capturing extra/additional insurance when sellers select it.

eBay labels Canada Post service for sellers is through the Solutions for Small Business (Canada Post offers this it's not an eBay program) this is a free service anyone can sign up for through CP.  Below is the link if you want to create your own personal account, you won't get the level 3 discount (only temporary from eBay at the moment) however as you spend money on shipping you can reach level 2, 3 and 4. There's also multiple shipping options that are exclusive to using Canada Post directly, some of them are helpful for more expensive items.

https://www.canadapost-postescanada.ca/cpc/en/business/small-business.page 

One possible reason that eBay labels is not capturing the extra insurance is because with a Solutions for Small Business account if you want to purchase insurance that amounts to $200 and over, Canada Post forces a signature (it checks off the signature box, greys it out, you cannot remove it, I posted photos showing examples) Regardless there's a big problem with eBay labels and Canada Post and currently eBay sellers that did nothing wrong are and will be paying the price for it.

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@mr.special-editions 

To clarify, spending money on ebay labels will not increase a seller's Canada Post small business account level as it is eBay buying the postage here, not each seller.  If a seller wants credit for each label on their own small business account they need to use Shippo or Snapship.  I'm not sure how PP has their labels set up right now.  At one time they required us to enter our sb number to print labels but apparently they no longer do that.

[pjcdn2005]

I'm sorry I don't remember exactly what you have tried so far but since there is evidence that you purchased the postage than you might try talking to ebay customer service on Facebook or Twitter by sending them a private message. There seems to be some sort of communication problem between CP and eBay labels so imo they should be responsible for the fixing the problem in your situation and for future situations.

[hlmacdon]

Yep, based on what the OP has provided here ebay buggered up their end when transmitting the shipment information for the label and should be on the hook for reimburing them. Given the raft of other implementation errors that have been plaguing the site that certainly seems highly plausible. I would avoid buying ebay labels myself where insurance or others addon services are used and use Snapship instead.

[mr.special-editions]

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To clarify, spending money on ebay labels will not increase a seller's Canada Post small business account level as it is eBay buying the postage here, not each seller.  If a seller wants credit for each label on their own small business account they need to use Shippo or Snapship.  I'm not sure how PP has their labels set up right now.  At one time they required us to enter our sb number to print labels but apparently they no longer do that.

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Correct, if you have your own CP account the first seven digits on all of your trackings is your account number with CP.  As of yesterday, CP applied most of the funds spent when I used eBay labels March/April 2021 to my personal account.  I was able to get this by speaking with an 'Agent/Supervisor' who was compassionate and granted my request.  CP agents that have the authority can issue what they term 'courtesies' it's entirely up to the agent you speak with, they will at least hear out your request.  The reason I contacted them had nothing to do with eBay labels, it was an issue where they offered me compensation and I suggested this instead as an alternative to paying me out (the only thing requested from them was all the tracking numbers via eBay labels for verification)

[envyemporium]

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@intimewithmusic wrote:

Hi taslim604

When you ship your items out do you allow the label vendor to use your Ebay listing title as the description of contents on the label?

I'm assuming this was the listing title of the missing item. 

EVGA GeForce RTX 3060 XC BNIB & SEALED

Thanks

ITWM

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Yes I believe so, and yes that was the item in question.