eBay

triber · ‎02-14-2022

Canada Post is now returning craft booklets and paper sewing patterns that are sent letter mail saying that have to go package rate. For sellers selling low cost craft items, having to charge or pay for package rate now makes them far too expensive. Has anyone else had them returned? I am going to phone CP and see if I can see what is going on.

dinomitesales · ‎02-15-2022

@vintagenorth wrote:
@dinomitesales
Hi, just wondering, when your item was returned, was the postage cancelled and now you have to use a new envelope and Sm Pkt postage or are you able to just add the difference in postage?

Yes, the postage was cancelled so unfortunately can not be used again. So I'm out $3.19 in that regard. I was still able to use the same envelope though; I just removed the stickers and address labels and affixed the new Small Packet label to send it out again.

Suffice it to say I'm now in the red for this particular sale lol.

lotzofuniquegoodies · ‎02-15-2022

@fh991586 wrote:
As far as Canada Post is concerned, a document has no commercial value in itself. It's a document, like a personal letter, family pictures or a printed contract. Its purpose is not to be sent as if it was a sold merchandise. Hence the poster or sewing patterns are not documents that would fit into lettermail internationally, but merchandise because of them being sold.

Just wondering if the trigger would be the cardboard...re: posters/sewing patterns. When it comes to customs they're within their right to open and inspect anything at their discretion. Other items could be picked up going down the line with xray. Everything is on the table now that they can scan bodies at the airport.😟

The first flag for anything going to the UK/EU etc would be a VAT number in the address label.

-Lotz

dinomitesales · ‎02-15-2022

@mrdutch1001 wrote:
I can fully understand video games, CDs etc being returned/not accepted within lettermail, but patterns, magazines & similar are printed matter and that is a whole lot different than merchandise such as games & Cds

While I understand where you're coming from (and agree 100%), we do need to remember that Canada Post has specifically stated that goods can not be shipped via International Letter-post, and that technically anything being mailed as the result of a sale would be considered "goods". So regardless of whether or not it's made of paper, anything that we sell on eBay and send on to a buyer is technically ineligible for Letter-post because it is inherently goods.

There are always going to be those things that fall in a 'grey zone' and in that case we're basically at the mercy of Canada Post as to whether or not they will allow it through. In the end the decision is probably being made subjectively by a a single person who decides the fate of the parcel. I'll definitely update if any additional information is released regarding what specific criteria they are looking for.

dinomitesales · ‎02-15-2022

@lotzofuniquegoodies wrote:
What would the call be on a couple of family photos sent to Nana internationally with a cardboard back and front so they didn't get bent?

-Lotz

I don't think anyone can answer that question right now, but the answer should be that it wouldn't be a problem as there is no written rule that Lettermail (either domestically or internationally) sent by Canada Post needs to be flexible to a certain degree.

dinomitesales · ‎02-15-2022

@marnotom! wrote:
... If Canada Post has gone to the trouble of getting a schwack of these stickers made up, it reinforces the hypothesis that CPC is now in hardcore mode enforcement. I suspect the same sticker would be used whether or not the lettermail item had a customs form on it.

I agree with this statement 100%.

Also worth noting that writing up a paper customs form and applying it to a Letter-post item with stamps would never be acceptable anyway because of the requirement for the customs data to be electronically attached to the item being mailed.

pjcdn2005 · ‎02-15-2022

@triber

I apologize if you already answered this but was there a customs form on the envelope?

grandmas-great-items · ‎02-15-2022

Acceptable Letter-post items | Canada Post (canadapost-postescanada.ca)

Items acceptable for the Letter-post service include:

Items made of paper or other material with the general characteristics of paper (for example, photographs)
Paper enclosures that meet the requirements for Letter-post (U.S. and International)

grandmas-great-items · ‎02-16-2022

Unacceptable Letter-post items | Canada Post (canadapost-postescanada.ca)

Unacceptable items

Items unacceptable for the Letter-post service include:

Small packets
Goods
Film, audio, or video recordings (for example, diskettes, CDs, or DVDs)
Unsealed self-mailers and envelopes
Items prohibited by law or defined as dangerous goods in Canada or in the destination country (see Non-mailable matter or International destination listing for more information)

Items unacceptable when attached to a postcard include:

Photographs
Cuttings of any kind
Fold-back sheets
Other items that stick out or are in raised relief

pjcdn2005 · ‎02-16-2022

Most people know this but just in case they don't......the above list is for international letter post. Canada Post refers to domestic as letter mail and international as letter post.

triber · ‎02-16-2022

No customs form, just regular letter mail, brown envelope and stamps, dropped into a mailing box.

triber · ‎02-16-2022

I can't see how a 2 page knitting leaflet is any different than a photograph. If mailing a document, how does Canada Post know the contents?

msau4301 · ‎02-16-2022

Wow, lots of responses here, major problem for sellers not wanting to chance getting their stuff sent back!

As many have said it must have to do with all the changes for taxes on any goods, the internet sales tax and all that stuff we can't control (the death and taxes thing!). It's too bad that if this is going to be the new normal that they wouldn't bring back a service like "Light Packet" USA or International. When I started selling here I used that service a ton of times. Selling Barbie clothes the packages were well under 150 grams and the width to qualify. The service cost was a little more than oversized mail but considerably less than small package rates (at least at that time).

They (Canada Post) stopped this service a few years back (maybe 5?), if they are insisting anything other than paper/documents is a package they should give us another option to use!

triber · ‎02-16-2022

I am just wading through and revising about 650 listing, the other 180 are already at small package rate. A lot of books ane patterns are now set aside and will be donated, people are not going to purchase some for less than $5 and pay up to $8.40 for postage! I am sure a lot of other craft sellers and others who have been using letter mail for their items are in the same dilemma. We can't risk having packages returned and having to pay the extra postage which would leave us in a negative situation.

marnotom! · ‎02-16-2022

@triber wrote:

I can't see how a 2 page knitting leaflet is any different than a photograph.

If it's a signed photograph of a celebrity that sold for $100, then there's no difference. They're both merchandise. They both need customs forms if being mailed to a location outside of Canada.

If it's a vacation photograph that one family member is sending to another, it's not merchandise and doesn't need a customs form if being mailed to a location outside of Canada.

msau4301 · ‎02-16-2022

I agree, that is awful!

fergua3 · ‎02-16-2022

i doubt this has much to do with the new tax laws. If Customs were the concern, CP could just make the requirement that all oversized lettermail from now on needs an electronic customs form, like packages do. The letter mail rates could stay the same, people could keep on using it.......just from now on add the customs form. Problem solved.

What is actually happening is a clear attempt by CP to make more money. They obviously could care less if thousands (tens of thousands) of small sellers are put out of business. I doubt CP will even make much more money; for every seller that reluctantly switches to packet rates there will probably be 5-10 who are forced to quit selling their small, low cost items. Since packet rates are about 3 times lettermail rates, the above scenario would see CP pulling in LESS revenue while at the same time putting thousands of sellers out of business, or at least significantly hurting their income.

I keep hearing that CP's responsibility is to serve the citizens of Canada. Doesn't seem like it to me..

marnotom! · ‎02-16-2022

@fergua3 wrote:

i doubt this has much to do with the new tax laws. If Customs were the concern, CP could just make the requirement that all oversized lettermail from now on needs an electronic customs form, like packages do. The letter mail rates could stay the same, people could keep on using it.......just from now on add the customs form. Problem solved.

Customs is actually the concern. The idea is to keep stuff that needs to be handled by customs separate from stuff that doesn't need to be handled by customs. International letters don't need to have customs information entered into the system and checked in upon arrival at the destination country. Putting customs forms on internatonal letters would defeat the whole point of having a separate mail stream.

Also note that our neighbours to the south have had to deal with variants of the "First Class International" service for several years now because of this distinction.

mrdutch1001 · ‎02-16-2022

well I do agree some of us are going to have to wade through hundreds of listings to make the necessary changes in light of this situation, but I for one disagree with your statement "people are not going to purchase some for less than $5 and pay up to $8.40 for postage!"

Over the years I have indeed had buyers purchase items & pay the postage as required in some of the categories where it just seems so ridiculously high. If the buyer truly wants the item, they will weigh in on the TOTAL cost of the item(item price plus shipping costs) and what it means to THEM...as what we sellers think is an exhorbiant postage cost may be acceptable to a buyer who genuinely is willing to pay what is necessary to get that item.

Years ago I stopped offering "worldwide" and eliminated a lot of countries that I'd ship to and a few years ago I dropped back to shipping to only USA & Canada. I will continue to list for both those countries and leave the decision about the shipping costs up to the buyer. I list & sell on other sites and this is all applicable to those sites as well.

I have nearly as many buyers from Canada as from the USA, so I will not remove listings and/or donate patterns & like material simply because it will cost more to ship to the USA.

fergua3 · ‎02-16-2022

i agree that 'some' buyers will pay higher shipping, but most won't. So the shipping cost increase could easily mean a 50-60-70% or more drop in sales and the sales that do happen will not bring in any increase in revenue per sale to offset the large drop in sales..

Maybe, as a result of this change, CP will bring back a low cost option like light packets down the road, expecially if my scenario is correct that this could actuallly cost CP revenue.

reallynicestamps · ‎02-16-2022

@triber

Alternately, you could raise the price of the patterns to cover the new cost and start advertising Free Shipping.

Or just to $9.99 and Flat Rate shipping of $3.40.

Keep in mind that the current price of brand new patterns is $15 -$25, so you are still below the market for new/unused and you are offering the convenience of to the door delivery.